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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Gay Doesn't Equal Sin

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BenBrockway
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Joined: 2006/5/31
Posts: 427


 Gay Doesn't Equal Sin

So, I was looking up Revival links on iTunes and came across this title, and it being Jay Bakker's church, I thought it was a sarcastic title, but I was wrong. Personally I am horrified by the disgusting filth, but does anyone else want to take a listen and share their reaction on it?

How we need a revival!

link: http://www.revolutionnyc.com/media.htm


Ben :-o :-( :-?

 2006/11/27 19:41Profile
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 Re: Gay Doesn't Equal Sin


"But be ye [b]doers[/b] of the word, and not hearers only [b]decieving[/b] your own selves." - James 1:22

"And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that [b]work[/b] iniquity." - Matthew 7:23


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2006/11/27 21:21Profile
enid
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Joined: 2006/5/22
Posts: 2642
Nottingham, England

 Re: Gay Doesn't Equal Sin

Listened to it. I have comments to make, not in favour of it, but I'll try not to sound biased, such as the speaker of the message was.

1 Tim 4v1-3, 'Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons,

verse 2, speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron,

vers 3, forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

It was sad to listen to. It was obvious that satan so has these people deceived that truth has to be twisted to make them feel good about themselves.

To also make themselves feel good, they have to condemn those who don't agree with them.

As for the sermon, the 'theology' in it had holes the size of cannon balls.

Hebrews 4v13, 'And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are naked and open to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account.

Sadly, they are headed for hell, unless God Himself reaches these people. How He will do it, only He knows, but the time is short.

That's it, for now!

God bless.

 2006/11/28 7:23Profile









 Re:

When the Word of God specifically calls something sin, who are we to say it isnt so? Do we dare call God a liar? Thats not something that I want to be held accountable for before the Judgement Seat...

Krispy

 2006/11/28 7:43
enid
Member



Joined: 2006/5/22
Posts: 2642
Nottingham, England

 Re: Gay Doesn't Equal Sin

As an aside, did he say something in the message about he's glad he's got his beer with him, but he hopes the people won't notice?

Did I hear wrong, or not?

Strong delusion.

God bless.

 2006/11/28 7:54Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

I read through the 'Idea' of Revolution (the site hosting this clip). It reads:

"[i]To show all people the unconditional love and grace of Jesus without any reservations because of their lifestyle or religious background, past or future. This love has no agenda behind it (I Cor. 13:5). This grace sets no timeline on personal change or standards for spiritual growth (Romans 4:4-5). The idea is to be a part of people’s lives because we truly care for them rather than to fulfill a religious duty; to walk with them through all their struggles as a part of their life, not as a religious outsider.[/i]

This is evidently Jim Bakkar's son whom I understand started out in 'ministry' in Pheonix at a very well known church that in no way would hold these views. My pastor was in attandance at the meeting when this young man gave his testimony and he was reunited with his father Jim. It is a very moving thing to watch or listen to. However, there has been some further collateral damage from all of the goings on back then.

It is important that we find a way to confront some of the misguided folk who have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. I have heard ministries that are dedicated to reaching the youth that absolutely believe in no repentance, no sin preaching and 15 second sinners prayers. They believe they are doing God a service.

Generally, I don't like saying it, but it seems that the ministries directed at youth seem to 'get by' with just about anything doctrinally or morally. And I'm a youth pastor. The older folk seem to just want to thank God they are doing something for God- so DON'T discourage them! Let them minister with blatant sin in their life and maybe- just maybe they'll repent. But whatever you do- don't run them off. I have seen youth destroyed almost beyond hope of recovery. Their consciences are all but seared from standing as a priest to do the work of God with every intention of going back out to a life of fornication or some other blatant sin. Their minds end up in a confusion you won't believe.


And while were on the subject we ought not be surprised when we look for the most RADICAL looking folk on earth to minister to, that when they do 'get saved' what they will sometimes bring to the table. I have heard preachers from these radical; street backgrounds that would CUSS a blue streak and preach Sunday Morning. I have witnessed this in the streets and have been a victim of their volitile and unpredictable behavior. I don't care how radically in sin a person is- they still need to be born again in a way that yields a Christ like life. I'm not impressed because some guy who has been to prison for 50 years is totting a bible- I want to see evidence of such a radical change that their life gets in step with God's word and they stop using 'excuses' that to do so would be to side with the 'religious' folk or to become pharisees. That is a cop-out. God can save a person from the lowest gutter- but thats what He does- He saves them.

We renounce who we used to be- we don't take it on as a means of ministry. That is taking Jesus' name onto whatever your pleasure. I want to be who I am and I want to 'add' Jesus to it? That is what were talking about here. I can come to Jesus and be a Christian_________ (You fill in the blank). And in my experience it does NOT last. They are trying to hang on to what they were rather than DYING to what they were.


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Robert Wurtz II

 2006/11/28 7:57Profile
preacherafla
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Joined: 2006/11/22
Posts: 96
Michigan, USA

 Re:

Col. 3:17
And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

When God says something is sin we cannot do that very thing in the name of Jesus. This needs to be the key in all we do and say. So it better be done and said in Christ's perfect love.

In His service,
Preacheraflame


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Steve

 2006/11/28 8:21Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
When God says something is sin we cannot do that very thing in the name of Jesus. This needs to be the key in all we do and say. So it better be done and said in Christ's perfect love.



This is a great point also. It is amazing to me as I read the New Testament how many [i]facets[/i] there is to the [u]expression[/u] of Christ's love. Sometimes that love was expressed with the most tender care as with the woman at the well or the woman taken in adultery and other times that love was ablaze in referring to the leaders of the times as vipers and hypocrites. I think the challenge in our times is not to call the women at the well a viper nor to treat the religious leaders who warrant a rebuke as the woman taken in adultery.

There was a man I came into contact with last week that was mocking our out reach ministry to the homeless as if he were demon possessed. I had taken all I could and turned to the man and rebuked the devil that was undoubtedly working in him. He suddenly came to his right mind and spoke a few more bizarre things. The Spirit of the Lord came upon me and I began to preach righteousness and judgment to come to this man. He then threatened to choke me to death and folk around we in fear he would. But, out of character for me as it was, I took a strong stand in love and the man's countenance changed. I gave him a bible and shook his hand. I found out later he had conspired to start a knife fight in our outreach in August and other things. the thing that stunned me is that a gal asked him as he was leaving WHY he took the bible. He said it was because it was the first time a Christian really challenged him and did not come off as goody goody (para). He could not receive love as I am used to giving it (hug, pat on back, God bless you, etc.). He needed challenged.

This week a gal came as we were loading up and was asked if she knew Jesus Christ. The Spirit of the Lord came on her and she was utterly broken with little preaching. All soft spoken and in love. We prayed with her and she turned to Christ. Now, what is it? Was the one wrong and the other right? No. We have to be sensitive to God and allow the Lord to deal with us one by one and one person at a time. No cookie cutter methods. Sometimes things are said in love that are not all that lovely [i]sounding[/i]. It is the 'spirit' behind what is said not the volume or tone or anything else. You can cut a person to the quick with a bad spirit and never raise your voice. And you can enguage in a strong conversation with a person in utter seriousness that is in the right spirit and a person be changed. the question is, "what Spirit are we of?"


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Robert Wurtz II

 2006/11/28 8:48Profile









 Re: Gay Doesn't Equal Sin

RobertW said

Quote:
Their minds end up in a confusion you won't believe.

Oh! Yes I do. It's mean. That's because it's Isaiah 5:20 - 23 in action, as much as bowing down to idols (Lev 18) in action.

 2006/11/28 10:46
GaryE
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Joined: 2005/4/26
Posts: 376
Mifflinburg, Pennsylvania

 Re:


{quote} Robert

Was the one wrong and the other right? No. We have to be sensitive to God and allow the Lord to deal with us one by one and one person at a time. No cookie cutter methods.
.................................................

Jud 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

Jud 1:21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Jud 1:22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:

Jud 1:23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.
.................................................

I’ve always taken the last two verses to mean that there are people who are won over only by love and there are people who are won over by only hearing of their sin condition and destiny if they persist in that condition. A method that would work for the one wouldn’t work for the other.


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Gary Eckenroth

 2006/11/28 11:32Profile





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