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lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Catholics saved?

First off. I'd like to say, I am/kinda was strongly against any belief that the Catholic have salvation but this seems to be changing.

Because, resently I asked the Lord to 'remove any unbiblical truth in my heart'. Then God(not satan, I had some very convincing confirmations about this) convicts me about condemning my brothers that go to catholic church.

Also, I talked with someone that I worked with and he replied to me like any born again believer would. "Jesus said He was the only way. Christ died and rose again to take away our sins." Personally, I was shocked after that conversation trying to convert him from Catholic to Protestant.

Honestly, I know many of you might be like 'ahh, you gotta be kidding me' but honestly think about it. Do Catholics worship the same Jesus?

I think it's the same Jesus. You might point to the first commandment(when referring to their salvation), but hey, we break them all (ever listen to Ray's preaching?). Plus, I think we all (if your being honest) have 'idols' in our lives but 'idols' [b]don't[/b] cause us to lose SALVATION!!

The word says, If you believe in your heart that Jesus died and rose again and confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, you WILL be saved. It doesn't say '100% accurate doctrine' nor 'perfect in worship with God'.

Do you think Mother Theresa's witness for CHRIST glorified God or satan? If you say 'satan' how? because most people say 'she was a saint' or 'a worker for Christ' not 'a worker for mary' or 'the devil'

I know I'm 'sturring' a lot of things up but honestly, take a deep consideration of this. Because we'd be rejecting billions of brothers and sisters. (over history)

Yes, they have deception but does deception mean not knowing Christ? If you say yes, I'm sorry but when you first knew Christ, you (including myself) had plently of deception in your heart. So, don't try to take a speck out when you had a log in yours.

I ask that anyone replies to this, takes a gentle spirit in doing so. Not being very hasty but in peace and humlity of God.

 2006/11/20 0:06Profile
JFEdgar
Member



Joined: 2005/10/21
Posts: 133
Wellington, Ohio

 Re: Catholics saved?

I grew up in a catholic church, was an atheist for several years and then came to Christ. To be honest, I have never seen a difference between the Catholic "Church" and the Evangelical "Church". They are both dead religions. Sure, there are many believers in both, but they are also filled with much deadness, lukewarmness and hypocrisy. Yes, catholics can be saved if Jesus truly is their Lord, living within them, causing them to know Him and the Father every day. This is what salvation is. There are many who profess the right doctrines in the "evangelical" world who do not have this, and are not saved. Doctrine is not and never was salvation, Jesus is salvation, and he will save those who repent and believe in Him, and he will save them by coming and living inside of them and making them alive to God and dead to sin.

Do you know the Father, or do you only know your bible, Mr. Evangelical? Do you love tradition and religion, or do you love Jesus, Mr. Catholic?

Is your head the beginning and end of your religion, or is your heart a dwellingplace of the Holy Spirit, your body the temple of the Living God? You will know if it is.


_________________
Joe E

 2006/11/20 1:00Profile
Here4Him
Member



Joined: 2006/9/23
Posts: 212
England

 Re:

Do you know the Father, or do you only know your bible, Mr. Evangelical? Do you love tradition and religion, or do you love Jesus, Mr. Catholic?

Is your head the beginning and end of your religion, or is your heart a dwellingplace of the Holy Spirit, your body the temple of the Living God? You will know if it is.




Very challenging and true.

I too was brought up a Catholic, my Father was a Catholic and his Parents before him, and theirs before that, and I tell you this- none of us found Christ in the Catholic church.

I do not deny that it may be possible for someone to find Him there, but it would amaze me if it happened seeing as the priests do not know Him, so how can they point others to Him. It is a form of godliness but denying its power.

All this saddens me very much because I know how many millions are being (and have been) deceived through the erroneous teachings of Catholiscism.

I challenge you, find a random Catholic and ask them to look in your eyes and tell you that they are 100% sure they are going to heaven. You will have to go along way to find one.

And let us not forget what a monster the Catholic church has been through church history especially in the times of the reformation. Have their teachings changed? No, not really. They still teach faith in Christ plus- this is an abomination to the God of grace. Thats not to mention transubstantiation, idols, confession to the priest, indulgences, prayers to saints, worship of Mary- all quite honestly repulsive to the living and true God who will not share His glory with another and who freely gives salvation to every repentant, believing sinner.

I am not syaing i hate Catholics- i even have been going into a Catholic school to take some RE lessons but I hate Catholiscm- you mention the billions of Catholics who have died down the ages and i would sadly assume that a great majority of that multitude are now lifting their eyes up in hell, cursing the very religion that promised them life and heaven.

We must not go soft on the truth. Many reformers died for the truth, died in fighting the erroneous doctrines of Rome, and while the old beast may not seem quite as vile now, it is still the same beast but with a few less teeth.

I think if our Lord was on earth today- He would speak most harshly against Roman Catholiscm, because like Phariseeism it has a large percentage of truth mixed in with a small amount of error- this is the most dangerous concoction- far more dangerous than outrageous error- this I reckon is the devil's most powerful weapon.

We should reject any form of 'Christianity' that does not preach the true gospel and the true Jesus, and any teaching which does not lead people to find the living Christ. I think Roman Catholiscm is one such 'church'. Paul says if anyone comes preaching another gospel then let him be accursed- he was not grey on this area.

If any poor Catholic by the grace of God does find Christ in Catholicism then I believ the Lord will say to them 'Come our from among them and be seperate, touch not the unclean thing and I will receive you"

We must sincerely love the Catholics and lovingly try to show them the truth, but we must be lovers of the truth- our God is- and so must we- we cannot compromise with error.

Have a look at the doctrines of the Catholic church and see what they really believe- it will shock you.

Blessings,

George


_________________
George Platt

 2006/11/20 8:17Profile
Mattie
Member



Joined: 2004/7/23
Posts: 210


 Re:

The queston boils down to what makes a man saved and how can we ultimately know the salvation of a soul? While the Holy Spirit bears witness to a converted man that he or she is a child of God, the Word talks clearly of being a "new creation, old things passing away and all things becoming new" and that newness is an ever-growing becoming like Jesus.

I do believe there are believers that are in the catholic church who God by His outstretched arm has saved within it. however, i believe that those believers who are still going there need to be forewarned of what the catholic church ultimately stands for and to be lovingly yet boldly directed to leave.

though christians may be IN the catholic church, catholicism as a whole is a false religion. it does not believe Jesus is the way the truth and the life. it believes it intellectually but it sure diminishes the atoning work of Jesus the way it talks of Mary and the saints.

remember the woman who told Jesus "blessed is the womb from which you were born!" (speaking of Mary obviously). Jesus responded "even more blessed is he who does the will of God." Though Mary had a special favor from God in being the mother of Jesus, we are just as blessed, even more blessed Jesus said to be His followers and disciples. No favoritism whatsoever. Yet this is hard for a catholic to hear.

 2006/11/20 9:21Profile
GraceAlone
Member



Joined: 2006/8/23
Posts: 232
Orlando, Florida

 Re:

not if thier theology is catholic


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Kristy

 2006/11/20 9:33Profile









 Re: Catholics saved?

The Catholic church has not changed it's theology one bit. The Catholic teachings on salvation are completely unbiblical, and anyone believing in that system for salvation is not saved. Period.

Any who calls himself a Catholic who believes in biblical salvation is not a true Catholic, and the Catholic Church would reject such a person.

If you think the Catholic Church is just another denomination, as many ignorant Christians do these days, just read the Council Of Trent and see exactly what the Catholic Church believes. And see how the Catholic Church curses those of us who believe the Bible's teachings on salvation. And understand that the Council of Trent was reaffirmed by the late "Pope" John Paul II, and by the current "pope".

Krispy

 2006/11/20 10:02
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4499


 Re:

Hello...

I know many individuals that came to the Lord while attending a Catholic Church. Yes, many of the official doctrinal beliefs of the Roman Catholic Church are far from Scriptural. But God's hand is still able to reach people within the walls of that corrupt organization. I know a few "newborn" individuals that truly love the Lord and still attend their home "church." But you can already tell that they are discovering the flaws in the Church's doctrine.

I know some other individuals who were saved while still attending Catholic, Mormon, and even far-out unscriptural Protestant churches. One might point out that there are some "evangelical" and "charismatic" churches that are just as doctrinally corrupt as the Roman Catholic Church. The point is that the "official" doctrine of a church never saved a single person. It is faith in Christ that saves us.

It is important that individuals reach out to Christ IN SPITE of their religious or doctrinal affiliation (or lack thereof). Will individuals that truly meet the Lord continue to attend such churches? As these individuals grow in the Lord, they will leave the organizations that preach blatantly false doctrines (like the Roman Catholic Church). Their hunger for the Truth (along with the grace of God) will guide them to "lie down in green pastures."

Keith Green (who was ethnically Jewish) found the Lord after a long search through traditional and non-traditional religions. He eventually came to the Lord at a small home meeting. Yet when he came to the Lord, some of his doctrinal beliefs were quite flawed (even questioning the deity of Christ). However, his conversion was [u]real[/u]. It wasn't long before Brother Keith lined up his beliefs with the Word of God instead of vice versa. His story, [i]No Compromise[/i], is a wonderful story of God's power to redeem in the midst of blatantly false beliefs.

:-)


_________________
Christopher

 2006/11/20 14:55Profile
lamuskrat
Member



Joined: 2005/10/3
Posts: 117
Gonzales, La

 Re: Catholics saved?

There was a little boy walking down the street carrying a basket of newborn puppies.


A catholic priest saw this little boy and asked the little boy what he had in the basket.


"Oh sir I have some catholic puppies in here" said the little boy. Well that just made that priests day, and he walked away joyfully.


About two weeks later, that same little bot was carrying that same basket full of puppies, when that same priest saw him. The priest asked "Little boy, how are those catholic puppies doing?".


"Oh no sir, these aren't catholic puppies..." said the little boy before he was interrupted.


"What?" asked the priest. "Two weeks ago you told me they were catholic puppies."


To this the little boy replied "Yes sir I did, but now they have their eyes open". :lol: ;-)


_________________
Mike Androne

 2006/11/20 17:16Profile
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re:

George said

Quote:
I challenge you, find a random Catholic and ask them to look in your eyes and tell you that they are 100% sure they are going to heaven. You will have to go along way to find one.



If you look at my orginal post, I think I stated that (i guess not clear enough).

This Catholic that I work with. Told ME, that "jesus is the ONLY way to heaven." and confessed Him as Lord FROM THE HEART. When I was speaking wtih him about Catholism.

I know what the Catholics believe. But! My question [b]wasn't[/b] "is there anything wrong with the Catholic church", but my question was [u]"Can a Catholic be saved?"[/u]

Mattie, Good balanced post.

Krispy, I totally understand your point of view. It's actually something I've strongly been conviced of for a while till resently.

I've been hearing on the radio (http://www.spiritfm905.com/) that Catholics believe in 'Grace, not of works for salvation'. This is a local CATHOLIC radio station started by the Catholic Diocese of St. Petersburg, Florida. This station has been around for numerous years now and plays GREAT Christian music (ya contemporary but that's a different topic).

Personally, when I was younger, I had an experience (chatting) with a 'Charasmatic Catholic' and I felt the presence of God when I was with her **(It was God, not demons, I know what demons are like, i.e. I've casted some out)**.

Also, resently this guy at my work, plus my uncle (both catholics) say, from their hearts, that they love Jesus and believe He died and rose again, and He is the only way to heaven.

These events over the past few years have caused me to 'rethink' my personal theology about them being saved or not. (Not condoning their idols and such)

Can you Krispy cite referances to the Catecism where they believe in works above grace for salvation?

I'm interested in the reply. Thanks everyone.

 2006/11/20 17:57Profile
DocH
Member



Joined: 2006/11/20
Posts: 5


 Re: Catholics saved?

I too am an Ex-Catholic.

When I got saved (heard the gospel in a Baptist church)it took the Holy Spirit three months to show me the errors of the Catholic church and prompt me to leave.

If someone claims to be a born again believer then they are no longer a Roman catholic because by definition they must deny the teachings of the Church. The main one being that the Mass is an ongoing sacrifice for the remission of sins for both the dead and the living. You can't possibly believe in the finished work of Christ on the cross of Calvary and at the same time believe and participate in the Mass. This is an oxymoron.

Be not deceived the modern Catholic has been taught about being born again, justification by faith and trusting in Jesus. The problem is that they have the Catholic and not the Biblical definition.

Yes your friend may say they trust in Jesus to get to heaven, so did I when I was Catholic. But I was not trusting in Jesus Christ ALONE. I was also trusting in my good works, the sacraments etc.

Ask them why God should let them into heaven. If they say that it is by FAITH and FAITH ALONE in the shed blood of Jesus Christ and that they are not trusting in anything else-then you probably have a saved friend. Pray for them and encourage them to leave the catholic church and get into a Bible believing/preaching Church.

I have personally found Charismatic Catholics the most difficult to witness to because they talk alot about Jesus and about being born again. When you press them though, they will admit they were born again when baptized as an infant and had a blessing which resulted in speaking in unknown tongues. These Catholics have a greater devotion to Mary, the Mass, praying the rosary etc than those who have not experienced the 'blessing'.

However, they are lost and heading for hell and need to hear the Biblical gospel.

 2006/11/20 22:17Profile





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