SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Looking for free sermon messages?
Sermon Podcast | Audio | Video

Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : THE RAPTURE: ARE YOU READY?

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 Next Page )
PosterThread
NLONG
Member



Joined: 2006/8/17
Posts: 111
Middlebury, Indiana

 Re:

Allhavsinned,

Quote:
Fine Jesus returns AFTER the trib, I agree, but we meet Him in the air, thats before the trib. Jesus doesn't come back twice, He calls us to Him, (before the trib) then He judges the earth (trib) and those who remain faithful are the sheep (not the Bride, they're gone) in the sheep and goat parable, Then He returns to earth (with us - 10,000s of His saints Jude v14)



I have never heard this before. That we are raptured, then trib, then Christ returns. I believe this is contradicted by 1 Cor. 15:22-23
"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's [b]at his coming[/b].

Beyond this, Mt 24 specifically states that Jesus comes immediately after the trib, all eyes will see Him, and then gathers the elect. Mt 24:29 "[b]Immediately after the tribulation of those days [/b] shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, [b]and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory[/b]. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, [b]and they shall gather together his elect[/b] from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

The problem is that everyone thinks that the trib is the wrath of God. While Revelation specifically states it is a time of Satan's wrath, which is 3.5 years long (Rev. 12:12-14).


_________________
Neil Long

 2006/11/10 9:27Profile
Rahman
Member



Joined: 2004/3/24
Posts: 1374


 i repent ...

Ya know my input on this thread regarding Matt. 24 has (i believe) prompted Holy Spirit to remind me AGAIN of Matt. 23, especially verse 24 ... :-(

i'm (un)done ... :-o

Whenever the rapture, may we be found not still arguing and debating it when He comes, but busy about our King's business! ... :-D

 2006/11/10 9:55Profile
PreachParsly
Member



Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re:

Quote:

NLONG wrote:

The problem is that everyone thinks that the trib is the wrath of God. While Revelation specifically states it is a time of Satan's wrath, which is 3.5 years long (Rev. 12:12-14).



This is where I always get stuck in the mud in my "end times thinking." What do you do with these verses. It isn't plain that the Tribulation is not the wrath of God.

Rev 15:1 And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.

Rev 15:7 And one of the four beasts gave unto the seven angels seven golden vials full of the wrath of God, who liveth for ever and ever.

Rev 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.


_________________
Josh Parsley

 2006/11/10 11:28Profile
NLONG
Member



Joined: 2006/8/17
Posts: 111
Middlebury, Indiana

 Re:

You can only find wrath of God for Armaggedon and last plagues (so stated in your message rev 15:1 "last 7 plagues"). Interestingly enough "wrath of God" isn't used until Rev. 14:10. The 2 times before this that talk about God's wrath is Rev 6 and Rev 11, both of which are the same event--the coming of Christ and time just preceeding. Mat 24 is also the same event as rev 6 and 11. Also, seventh vial is same event with time just preceeding being all seven vials. Also Ezek 38, I believe talks of same event.

Why is it that when Christians are having a perfectly civil dialogue that someone must break in and say there's an argument. I'm neither arguing or pummeling people. Those who are Christs are hungry for truth, this desire for truth leads to discussion. I've appreciated the discussion! Personally, haven't seen people reason some of these ways. I appreciate people saying, "Have you considered this perspective!" That's one thing the church is for--iron sharpens iron.

Thanks all.


_________________
Neil Long

 2006/11/10 12:48Profile
Rahman
Member



Joined: 2004/3/24
Posts: 1374


 i apologize ...



Bro NLONG,

i think it safe to assume that i'm that "someone" you're refering to ... :-D

You wrote;
"I've appreciated the discussion! Personally, haven't seen people reason some of these ways. I appreciate people saying, "Have you considered this perspective!"


Please forgive me bro, for it wasn't obvious to me that your perspective was one of discussion and reasoning. i thought you we're just another one of us saints convinced of our rightness on this topic to the exclusion of all others, and so i did make the same assumption toward you and this thread from the many other threads on SI about this subject (type in "rapture" under search and you'll see what i mean), many of which started out civil enuf but become combative and devisive in progression ... It just bothers me greatly when such topics as "the rapture" and whether "once saved, always saved" seems to not only divide us into camps, but also take up so much time and energy whilst the world is going to hell in a hand basket ...

So i've edited my previous comment to fit your objection;

"Whenever the rapture, may we be found not still arguing, debating or [b]having a perfectly civil dialogue about it[/b] when He comes, but busy about our King's business! ...

Blessing!


 2006/11/10 13:40Profile
NLONG
Member



Joined: 2006/8/17
Posts: 111
Middlebury, Indiana

 Re: i apologize ...

Bro Rahman,

Hey Thanks for making me laugh today! No seriously.

I wasn't refering only to you, though you did encourage the remark :)

Unfortunately, I am at times very blunt and opinionated. May the Lord own my heart in all areas and at all times! But I have seriously considered all the viewpoints, except haven't gotten to the first one totally, which was a very long thread.

I guess from my viewpoint its kind of obvious. But to others perhaps I am obviously wrong?! I just hope that if there is scripture to "dethrone" :) my viewpoint I would change it and not hold my opinion over our Lords. That would be a doctrine of man, yes?

Thanks for editing your previous comment for my toes feel much better. But your absolutely right, Hell is filling by the second. Hopefully, we all aren't totally wasting our time here.

Peace & blessings.


_________________
Neil Long

 2006/11/10 14:08Profile
Rahman
Member



Joined: 2004/3/24
Posts: 1374


 Re: i apologize ...



Bro. NLONG ...

And thank you for both laughing at, and with a brother ...
:-P

i know what you mean about being blunt and opinionated, me too ... Tho i'm still opinionated, our Lord has really been about tearing down my bluntness (much by way of this very SI Forum).

Bless Him that we're all His works in progress, and that His Spirit of agape and brotherly love has prevailed here.

Our God is good! ... :-D

 2006/11/10 14:28Profile
RevivalArmy
Member



Joined: 2006/7/26
Posts: 28
DETROIT, MI

 Re:

Quote:
Mt 24:29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.



Amen. I don't think it could be clearer as to the order of things.

Is it possible that the Apostle Paul was familiar with this saying of Jesus and had the same trumpet in mind in 1Co 15:51-53?

"Behold, I show you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at [b]the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound,[/b] and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality."


_________________
Josef Urban

 2006/11/10 14:43Profile
saved_matt
Member



Joined: 2005/7/3
Posts: 233
Lancashire, England

 Re:

I was just wondering if anyone on this thread could recommend a series of messages studying Revelation (end time prophecy) from a POST-trib persepctive,

Ive been brought up solely on pre-tirb teaching but I'm willing to study other theologies that have arisen from different interpretation of these scriptures,

so any recommendfations would be greatly appreciated.

matt and mim


_________________
matt

 2006/11/10 17:28Profile
RevivalArmy
Member



Joined: 2006/7/26
Posts: 28
DETROIT, MI

 Re:

Altough I do not know his views on End Times Theology, or his view on the rapture for that matter, you can check out Zac Poonen's verse by verse sermon series through the book of Revelation here: http://www.cfcindia.com/web/mainpages/verse_by_verse.php?book=vbv_revelation

Here's his book on Revelation verse by verse:
http://www.cfcindia.com/web/mainpages/book_window.php?book=the_final_triumph

I [b]believe[/b] he is post-trib in his theology, but I am not sure. If you're interested give it a check!

I would highly reccomend the rest of Zac Poonen's teachings, you can get them on his site (www.cfcindia.com). I've been listening to his verse-by-verse on Matthew and so far it's been a blessing.


_________________
Josef Urban

 2006/11/10 19:19Profile





©2002-2019 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy