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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : "By His stripes we are healed"

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Here4Him
Member



Joined: 2006/9/23
Posts: 212
England

 "By His stripes we are healed"

I attend a pentecostal church and i often hear people praying for divine healing and expecting it as there right because as they quote, it is written 'By His stripes we are healed'.

Is this legitimate? Are these well meaning people misinterpreting scripture?

Does it mean this?

I know it is talking of being healed and cleansed from the disease of sin but is it also literal?

It is interesting that in Matt 8:17 Matthew quotes from Isaiah 53 in connection with the divine healings that had just taken place 'He Himself took our infirmities and bore our sicknesses'.

Did our Lord bare our sickenesses at the cross? Is phsical healing part of the victory of the cross as the Pentecostals believe?


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George Platt

 2006/11/2 17:15Profile
MisterCheez
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Joined: 2006/2/22
Posts: 96
Colorado

 Re: "By His stripes we are healed"

That my friend, is the million dollar question.


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Brian Erickson

 2006/11/3 2:21Profile
philologos
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Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re: "By His stripes we are healed"

Quote:
Did our Lord bare our sickenesses at the cross? Is phsical healing part of the victory of the cross as the Pentecostals believe?


I believe that God still heals today. I believe that supernatural gifts and ministries continue in the church today. However I do not believe that...
[color=0000ff]“Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed. For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.” (1Pet 2:24-25 KJVS)[/color]
...is a reference to physical healing. I have continued to the end of the passage to show the context. The healing referred to here is that of the waywardness of the heart.

I have carefully steered around the last paragraph in your question because all that God does for us is through the effects of the work done on the cross. However, I do not believe that 'healing is in the atonement' in the same way that forgiveness is.

On the basis of what Christ has done on the cross we may come to him, confess our sin, and receive instant forgiveness and cleansing... [color=0000ff]If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1John 1:9 KJVS)[/color] God is honour-bound to fulfill this promise on the grounds on a Propitiation who stands in the heavens. As an old Charles Wesley hymn states it 'he cannot turn away the presence of His son'.

There is no such provision for sickness. We cannot, as the faith merchants suggest, 'claim' our healing. But we are encouraged to pray for each other that we might be healed which shows the general indication of God's heart towards us. If healing were 'in the atonement', to encourage us to plead for each other's 'healing' would be a massive intrusion into the personal relationship between God and his children. This would also imply that we would need 'gifts of forgiveness' in our gatherings as well as 'gifts of healings'. It would also imply that the elders would visit and pray for the forgiveness of the saints' sins as well as for their healing.

Healing is a gospel sign not an unconditional effect of the cross.


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Ron Bailey

 2006/11/3 9:46Profile
MisterCheez
Member



Joined: 2006/2/22
Posts: 96
Colorado

 Re:

First, I think we can all agree that we would all prefer God's will to be healing in all cases (except, perhaps, an old person who is ready to go) and no one wants to misrepresent God's will on such a topic. Here are some observations:

-In general, Christ seemed to heal just about everybody who needed healing and the word says the works He did we will do also and even greater.

-A number of scriptures exist which do endorse physical healing (this is not exhaustive):

- Mark 16:18 says that believers will lay hands on the sick and they will recover

- 1 Thessalonians 5:23
speaks of God sanctifying us wholly - spirit, soul and body.

- Psalm 103:2-3
speaks of the benefits of the Lord - who heals all of our diseases

- James 5:14-15
says that the sick are to go to the elders of the church, be anointed, prayed for and the prayer offered in faith will save the sick and any sins they have commited will be forgiven.

- Proverbs 4:20-22
speaks of Gods word being health to all our flesh (bones).

-Though I'm not fond of using the verse this way, Isaiah 53:5-6 can be looked at in an interesting way:

He was wounded for our transgressions
[i](outward sin)[/i]
He was bruised for our iniquities
[i](inward sin - so all sin is covered, inward and outward)[/i]
The chastisement for our peace was upon Him
and by His stripes we are healed.
[i](since all sin was covered in the first two lines, is it possible this refers to sickness & disease? Also, would God use the word healed when are spirits are actually reborn?)[/i]

- Paul instructed Timothy to take some wine for an ailment, why didn't he tell him to overcome it by faith if healing is God's will all the time?

- Paul left someone behind because he was sick (was it Trophemus?). Why didn't he just pray over him?

- Some think Paul's thorn in the side was a physical problem.

- In Acts 5:16, all of the sick people were healed - this was done by the hands of the apostles, not Jesus.

- Romans 8:11 speaks of the Holy Spirit giving life to our mortal bodies.

- Sickness and disease seem to be tied into sin and resulted after the fall. With that in mind, look at these scriptures:

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.

1 John 3:8b
For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil.

Faith seems to be a major issue here. Our words do have power (study blessings and curses) and what we confess does matter:

Proverbs 18:21
Death and LIFE are in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.

Mark 11:22-23
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God. For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.

1 John 5:14-15
Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him.

There is evidence that healing is often (if not always) God's desire. If we walk in unbelief or believe that miracles have ceased - why should we expect to see any?

I believe God loves to heal and have actually experienced demonic manifestation and release when someone prayed against cancer in me - which I had (don't any longer). So I say pray with boldness knowing that God can heal and loves to do so - the rest is up to Him. Ask and receive.

Disclaimer: If you pray for someone and he/she is not healed, condemning God for lying or condemning the person for having a lack of faith is very foolish - perhaps it is you who is the problem. Or perhaps God has other plans.



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Brian Erickson

 2006/11/3 11:00Profile
Rahman
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Joined: 2004/3/24
Posts: 1374


 Re: "By His stripes we are healed"



To the great dismay of many a Pentecostal i know, i believe of this passage of scripture (by whose stripes ye were healed) exactly as bro Ron posted ...

Bro Ron wrote;
"Healing is a gospel sign not an unconditional effect of the cross."

Man did this phrase just really blow me away in it's precision!

 2006/11/3 12:52Profile
FathersHeart
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Joined: 2006/11/3
Posts: 2
Melbourne, Australia

 Re: "By His stripes we are healed"

I would say from what I believe from reading God's word that healing is for everyone (Therin is another puzzle for there are sometimes reasons/blockages to healing, ie: Unforgivenss, curses etc - But God will reveal these to the ernest believer so they can be broken and set free(Even the blind man born blind to glorify God was healed.) It is however God's timing when and how to heal someone. If we look at men and women over the past 2 centuries we will see how God used in them miraculously. Sometimes theologian forget to let "the main things be the main things" Look what God says to us in Psalm 91 (this is also pre-Christ). Now we live under the New Covenant made by Jesus, so we are not under law but Grace. It is vitaly important that whatever one does "in the name of Jesus" that we are individually responsible to have a personal intimate relationship with God as "Abba -Father" (that means reading His Word as well). Too many theologians are as dry as tinder and have no relationship with Jesus, please beware of such individuals. Also some believers can become "Too" spiritual and have their heads in some sort of spiritual cloud. We can never order or command God to heal or do anything He is no Genie in a bottle. If I recall whenever Jesus healed He did so with great compassion,
Ps 91:14 “Because he loves me,” says the LORD, “I will rescue him; I will protect him, for he acknowledges my name.
Ps 91:15 He will call upon me, and I will answer him; I will be with him in trouble, I will deliver him and honor him. r
Ps 91:16 With long life s will I satisfy him and show him my salvation. t ”

God is a God of Mercy and Compassion, full of love and Grace, He does also discipline those he loves (not inapropriately like man - His discipline draws us lovingly back to Him). He does have a time for Judgement and wrath but this is not for His children


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Rich

 2006/11/3 22:10Profile
crsschk
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Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Thanks Ron,

This is so well stated, couldn't agree more with Ramon's expression.

[b]We are healed[/b] - literally, it is healed to us; or healing has happened to us. The healing here referred to, is spiritual healing, or healing from sin. Pardon of sin, and restoration to the favor of God, are not unfrequently represented as an act of healing. The figure is derived from the fact that awakened and convicted sinners are often represented as crushed, broken, bruised by the weight of their transgressions, and the removal of the load of sin is repesented as an act of healing. ‘I said, O Lord, be merciful unto me; heal my soul, for I have sinned againt thee’ Psa_41:4. Have mercy upon me, O Lord, for I am weak; O Lord, heal me, for my bones are vexed’ Psa_6:2. ‘Who forgiveth all thine, iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases Psa_103:3. The idea here is, that the Messiah would be scourged; and that it would be by that scourging that health would be imparted to our souls.

It would be in our place, and in our stead; and it would be designed to have the same effect in recovering us, as though it had been inflicted on ourselves. And will it not do it? Is it not a fact that it has such an effect? Is not a man as likely to be recovered from a course of sin and folly, who sees another suffer in his place what he ought himself to suffer, as though he was punished himself? Is not a wayward and dissipated son quite as likely to be recovered to a course of virtue by seeing the sufferings which his career of vice causes to a father, a mother, or a sister, as though he himself When subjected to severe punishment? When such a son sees that he is bringing down the gray hairs of his father with sorrow to the grave; when he sees that he is breaking the heart of the mother that bore him; when he sees a sister bathed in tears, or in danger of being reduced to poverty or shame by his course, it will be far more likely to reclaim him than would be personal suffering, or the prospect of poverty, want, and an early death. And it is on this principle that the plan of salvation is founded. We shall be more certainly reclaimed by the voluntary sufferings of the innocent in our behalf, than we should be by being personally punished. Punishment would make no atonement, and would bring back no sinner to God. But the suffering of the Redeemer in behalf of mankind is adapted to save the world, and will in fact arrest, reclaim, and redeem all who shall ever enter into heaven.

(Sin is not only a crime for which we were condemned to die, and which Christ purchased for us the pardon of, but it is a disease which tends directly to the death of our souls, and which Christ provided for the cure of. By his stripes, that is, the sufferings he underwent, he purchased for us the Spirit and grace of God, to mortify our corruptions, which are the distempers of our souls; and to put our souls in a good state of health, that they may be fit to serve God, and prepare to enjoy him. And by the doctrine of Christ’s cross, and the powerful arguments it furnisheth us with against sin, the dominion of sin is broken in us, and we are fortified against that which feeds the disease - Henry.)

Albert Barnes

([i]We would have to have a whole lot of explaining to do if we are getting sick in the first place with this 'provision' in place.[/i])


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Mike Balog

 2006/11/3 22:35Profile
Logic
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Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re: "By His stripes we are healed"

Quote:

Here4Him wrote:
I attend a pentecostal church and i often hear people praying for divine healing and expecting it as there right because as they quote, it is written 'By His stripes we are healed'.

Is this legitimate? Are these well meaning people misinterpreting scripture?



[b]Isa 53:5[/b] [color=990000]But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his [b]stripe[/b] we are healed.[/color]
The word "stripe" in Hebrew is actualy in the singular.
It was the stripe from His Father that healed us from the broken relationship between Him and us.

If you put the verse in context: our transgressions, our iniquities, the correction of our welfare on Him; none of these lead to the thought of health but a broken relationship.

 2006/11/4 0:52Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

These are the verse which spring to mind...

[color=0000ff]Jer. 3:22 Return, ye backsliding children, and I will heal your backslidings. Behold, we come unto thee; for thou art the Lord our God.

Hos. 14:4 I will heal their backsliding, I will love them freely: for mine anger is turned away from him. [/color]


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Ron Bailey

 2006/11/4 2:06Profile
Here4Him
Member



Joined: 2006/9/23
Posts: 212
England

 Re:

Thank you all for your thoughts. Brother Ron B, what you said was particularly helpful. I think i agree with that and the scriptures that have been put forward have helped me to understand this subject. So thank you all and the Lord bless you!

George


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George Platt

 2006/11/4 9:56Profile





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