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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Spiritual Gifts Described in 1Cor 12-14

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GraceAlone
Member



Joined: 2006/8/23
Posts: 232
Orlando, Florida

 Re:

Well, here is my honest opinion of this whole situation. There is a false assurance rendered by Charismatics of salvation. They believe they are saved, proof being, thier own experiences- or "speaking in toungues (babble)". They tend to rely on themselves and thier "spirituality". Not that all Charismatics do this but when I go witnessing this is A PATTERN. I even met a lost woman who believed in tougues because "she spoke with them" (she was lost). I have a close relative who is lost but is caught up in the pride of being "spiritual" along with the most of the "Charismatic movement". The problem is that they are turning the term "spiritual" into a pretense. I hold a grudge, but I'm sure there are some sincere Christians caught up in that mess. Experience never over rules scripture. Never. It sounds like a false gospel of works to me when its abused. Never rely on your experiences, rely on scripture. If you want to know if you're saved, read the bible and find out. We just need to get the truth out there.

I don't mean to offend, but a false assurance gospel is offensive to God.

Back on subject...

The bible says that 1 Corinthians 12:13
"For by one Spirit WE WERE ALL baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit." If you are saved you've had the "baptisim of the Spirit". All believers have the indwelling of the Spirit.


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Kristy

 2006/9/19 23:48Profile
GraceAlone
Member



Joined: 2006/8/23
Posts: 232
Orlando, Florida

 Re:

What do you think of that verse?

1 Corinthians 12:13
"For by one Spirit WE WERE ALL baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into one Spirit." If you are saved you've had the "baptisim of the Spirit". All believers have the indwelling of the Spirit.

And this one?

John 14:16-17
"16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever—the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you."

and this one...
Romans 8:9
"9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His."

...
Gal. 4:6
"Because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father"."


All people who are saved have the indwelling of the Spirit.




Also consider this...
Mabey this might help;

One day I found myself utterly confused about "tougues" in 1 cor 14:12. Compared to Acts 2 it was obviously not talking about the same gift of toungues. Let me explain.

1. In Acts chpt 2 all the people who heard the galieans speaking heard them in thier language.

Man Speaks -----> all languages understand.

2. In 1 Cor 14:12, there is an aparent need for an interpreter!

Man speaks ----->One person understands.

Well in Acts chapter 2 there was no need for an interpreter because the people were speaking with the gift of toungues. In 1 Cor 14:12, there was a need for an interpreter because some body was speaking in a language which needed interpretation! Clearly, this needs to be shown to the masses.


_________________
Kristy

 2006/9/20 8:48Profile
letsgetbusy
Member



Joined: 2004/9/28
Posts: 957
Cleveland, Georgia

 Re:

I agree that many get too caught up in the gifts rather than in the Giver. But for me, I think that a genuine baptism of the Spirit of God doesn't come to someone who isn't caught up in love for God and fellow man.

Actually, I was baptized with the Holy Ghost about one year ago, without tongues. I prayed for God to give me tongues if it was His will, I read about how people receive them, did all the homework, etc, etc. I don't write off anyone on the matter, but in my experience, and in the experiences of others (Alan Redpath for example), I repeat, in MY experience, many that claim to talk in tongues are often not living a holy life.

Again, I could be wrong about my doctrinal stand on the gifts subject, but it might be that Satan is leading people into false experiences, and attempting to pollute a genuine experience of glossalia.

A guy I work with in the ministry told me this story. He said while he was working in his college ministry years back, that he worked with people of all denominations. He told about one young man who would often stand up during devotion / services and walk around like a zombie with his arms up and go and grab someone by the wrist and lead them to the front.

He said one day after the man had stood up, and started to come near him, he said to himself, 'not me, not me.' But nonetheless the young man grabbed his wrist and lead him to the front of the service. Once there, the leader asked him if he was saved, to which he answered 'yes, I am saved.' Then the man asked him if he could speak in tongues to which he replied, 'no.' So the man said, 'Say Hallelujah five times,' which he did. Then the man said, 'faster,' which he did. And again, and again, 'faster, faster.'

So he said that he finally just cried out and made a bunch of jibberish to make them leave him alone.

Maybe it is not some of you that talk in tongues personally, but I have been around people of the tongues persuasion, and something is just not right about their spirit. Not that they are unsaved, but there is something wrong with their walk. The best case scenario here is that I am wrong, and God will correct me, but it just seems to keep resurfacing that there is something wrong with the modern day Charismatic movement.

I have heard some preach on the Asuza Street days, and that what they had is not what people have today. Maybe someone could enlighten me on this. Like the Methodists of today, who do not have the Holy Ghost fire of John Wesley, maybe it is the same case with the Charismatics of today. They are going through the same experiences, but the fire of God isn't there.

Please enlighten or correct me where I am wrong.

EDIT: I need to add this as it would not be fair to not do so. The same man who above told me about being lead to the front of the service and all, told me of another young guy he was in college with. He said that they would pray together often, and then out of the blue, the man began to speak in an untelligable speech. He said that the man was Baptist, and had not been raised in a tongues speaking church, but didn't know if he had been exposed to tongues before.

While he laughed about the first incident, he did say that he thought the second man did have a genuine experience of tongues.


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Hal Bachman

 2006/9/24 1:08Profile









 Re:

Hello, I thought this thread was done. I just noticed today that it was still going.

When I speak of not ignoring scripture I am trying to help everyone realize that they must consider all the scripture on the subject and that their conclusion must not render any of those scriptures "void or unreasonable" It's not about not agreeing with me when I press this point it's about workingf to achieve the goal that Paul beseeched us to speak the same things and be of the same judgement.

It was a spiritual gifting of the Holy Ghost to reach all those who spoke diffrent languages that were gathered there at that time.

God bless, John

 2006/9/24 1:37
GraceAlone
Member



Joined: 2006/8/23
Posts: 232
Orlando, Florida

 Re:

Quote:
It was a spiritual gifting of the Holy Ghost to reach all those who spoke diffrent languages that were gathered there at that time.

Amen.


_________________
Kristy

 2006/10/2 9:00Profile





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