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beenblake
Member



Joined: 2005/7/26
Posts: 524
Tennessee, USA

 Re:

Yes indeed, I must have posted just as Krispy did. Lol. I suppose that is one of supporting my brother, to share in his afflictions.

After reading the responses, I must add I like the quote by Keith Green..."Hope for the rapture, but prepare for tribulation activity."

I would have to say, however, if any person truly believed that we should be prepared for tribulation activity, wouldn't they warn others of the tribulation?

Just a thought,

Blake


_________________
Blake Kidney

 2006/8/16 16:11Profile
Onesimus4God
Member



Joined: 2006/1/16
Posts: 217
Chapala, Jalisco, Mexico

 Re:

I'll be happy to sound the alarm. I have in other places. I believe with all my heart that the church will be here during the tribulation period and many will suffer and die for thier faith. I believe that is what the bible teaches. Otherwise, the saints mentioned in the Revelation would not be members of the church, since the church is already gone.
See, we get all mixed up in disagreement when we try to read in more than is there. If we would simply look at what scripture says, the whole plan outline is rather simple. How it all will work out is not simple.
When Israel signs a peace treaty with the Arabs, set your 7 year clock to ticking. It's underway, regardless of biblical interpretation. God's Word will come to pass as He says it will.
Our dearly departed brother Green was exactly correct. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. I don't think many are prepared, because of the "rapture" teaching that so many herald as truth in this hour. That is why it frustrates me so much and why it is so very alarming. They are not ready when their cash fails. They are not prepared to die and/or watch family members die rather than take the mark of the beast. Why? Because they are taught continually that the rapture will take them out of here.
Not long ago, I was listening to a southern gospel music countdown. Over half the songs played that day were about the rapture. Who would benefit most from a church unprepared? Satan of course. Who would benefit least from a church prepared to forsake all for the Gospel? Satan of course.
In order for the deception to come, someone has to be decieved. These are church folks. So not all are smart, nor well informed. They do not take time to search the scriptures daily to see if these things be so. They would rather believe what they are told as "gospel". Since appeals to the flesh, it is satisfying. Well, they are in for a huge disappointment.
Again, I listed some very simple texts, easy to read and understand. Jesus said He would raise believers on the last day. There can only be one last day, that being at the end of the mellinual reign of Jesus with those who gave their lives during the trib. They are resurrected just before the millineum starts, in the "first resurrection". There can only be one "first resurrection. It happens when Jesus comes, the 2nd time. He can only come the second time one time. That is clearly at the end of the trib. Read Rev 19. It's quite simple and all fits if you believe what the bible says. If not, there will always be dispute and discord. Why? Because some find it easier to be spoon fed than to hunger for meat. That is their privilege. But all will have to endure the consequences of such a grave error.

Selah and shalom,

"O"


_________________
Lahry Sibley

 2006/8/16 18:36Profile
JoeA
Member



Joined: 2004/11/29
Posts: 364
Decatur, Illinois

 Re:

To those who believe in a post-trib rapture, i have a question.

What did Jesus mean when He said "I come quickly", and "No man knows the day or the hour", and "Watch, for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come", and that He's coming as a "thief in the night".

If the rapture will be at the end of the tribulation period, which we know will last 7 years, how is it that we should be watching for Him? If the rapture is post-trib, then we do know the day, because it will be seven years after the tribulation begins.

Not trying to defend pre-trib, just trying to clarify something here.

Also, concerning what the dear Keith Green said about "Pray for pre-trib, prepare for the tribulation". That's good advice, but shouldn't we also be preparing for a pre-tibulation rapture also? Jesus said "Be ye ready".


_________________
Joe Auvil

 2006/8/17 14:43Profile
beenblake
Member



Joined: 2005/7/26
Posts: 524
Tennessee, USA

 Re:

Quote:
If the rapture will be at the end of the tribulation period, which we know will last 7 years, how is it that we should be watching for Him? If the rapture is post-trib, then we do know the day, because it will be seven years after the tribulation begins.



That's assuming we can discern exactly the events of the bible in real life. Most of biblical prophecy is written in such a way that we can only guess as to which events match the actual events in real life.

It wasn't until after Jesus died, and came back, that He could explain all the prophecy about His death and life in OT scripture. I am sure we won't know until after it actually happens that we will say, "Oh yeah, now I see."

In love,
Blake


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Blake Kidney

 2006/8/17 15:09Profile









 Re:

Quote:
I am sure we won't know until after it actually happens that we will say, "Oh yeah, now I see."



Hmmm... I hope for your sake (since your confident you'll be here) that you dont realize on Wednesday that that GPS/personal info chip you had implanted in your forhead on Tuesday was actually the "Mark of the Beast".... cuz by that point it'll be too late for you.

Krispy

 2006/8/17 15:25
NLONG
Member



Joined: 2006/8/17
Posts: 111
Middlebury, Indiana

 Re: The Pre-Trib Rapture

Have I entered the jihad on trib doctrine page?

Thanks for your stance "O"
The best argument for pre-trib is the good ole "Why would a loving God let his church suffer." These people have totally lost all reality with scripture if God won't let His Church suffer. Like none of the apostles suffered :)

Actually, post-trib here. I wasn't raised in the church so I don't have a lot of hangups. Now don't go sayin I'm bashing you all pre-trib people.

Post trib is clearly seen in Mt 24...the bible states that Jesus will return "after the tribulation of those days."

Beyond this Tribulation is the wrath of satan, the vials and armageddon is wrath of God. All reference to tribulation is 3.5 years (42 months, times + time + 1/2 time, the the equivalent in days). No such thing as 7 year trib.


_________________
Neil Long

 2006/8/17 15:50Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
I have stepped on a number of toes here from time to time, and I just want to offer some advise on how to avoid doing that. I learned the hard way.


Some of us feel qualified to take a 'Master Class' on this topic. ;-)


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2006/8/17 15:56Profile









 Re:

One thing that amazes me is the hostility toward pre-tribbers from post-tribbers.

So now I have lost reality with scripture? Why? Because you dont agree with me on one particular doctrine? When did I say God wouldnt allow His church to suffer? The most vibrant church in the world right now is in China... where they are suffering horribly.

The difference is that during the Church age dispensation we suffer the wrath of the world... of wicked men. But the Great Tribulation is the wrath of God on the world. Thats the difference. We WILL suffer the wrath of men (tho not so much here in the US... so far). But we will NOT suffer the wrath of God. Why would we? We are not under His judgement as the world is.

But who am I? Just another nut who has lost touch with reality... right?

Krispy

 2006/8/17 16:02
MSeaman
Member



Joined: 2005/4/19
Posts: 772
Michigan

 Re:

Quote:

KrispyKrittr wrote:
But who am I? Just another nut who has lost touch with reality... right?

Krispy




LOL...sorry, but that just cracked me up. :-P

My church teaches pre-trib rapture. I have reserved judgment for lack of wisdom on my part.

I also agree with Keith Green, pray for pre-trib, but prepare for post...


_________________
Melissa

 2006/8/17 16:08Profile
roaringlamb
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 1519
Santa Cruz California

 Re:

Quote:
If the rapture will be at the end of the tribulation period, [b]which we know will last 7 years[/b], how is it that we should be watching for Him? If the rapture is post-trib, then we do know the day, because it will be seven years after the tribulation begins.



Hello brethren, I just wanted to ask how we know the "Tribulation" will last 7 years? Also, I lovingly challenge you to respond with scripture that is not from Daniel 9:27.
It would seem quite a shaky doctrine to be held so tightly if there is no real clear cut Scriptural basis for it.
I think many have read too much into one verse and built a whole fantastic, very scholarly sounding Eschatology. Yet it just does not hold much water.
This is not to debate or argue, simply to ask why, and sharpen a little iron, and be sharpened myself.
Blessings in the name of our Lord


_________________
patrick heaviside

 2006/8/17 16:16Profile





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