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murdog
Member



Joined: 2006/2/4
Posts: 352
Fort Frances, Ontario

 Death, and then what?

Members,

I have a question for you. When we die, are we resting(sleeping) until the trumpet blast. The dead in Christ rise. Or do we go immediately to Heaven or Hell? Like Lazarus and the Rich Man?

Need some clarification.

Murray


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Murray Beninger

 2006/8/15 1:45Profile
JoeA
Member



Joined: 2004/11/29
Posts: 364
Decatur, Illinois

 Re: Death, and then what?

Philippians 1:20 "According to my earnest expectation and my hope, that in nothing I shall be ashamed, but that with all boldness, as always, so now also Christ shall be magnified in my body, whether it be by life, or by death.

21 "For to me to live is Christ, and [b]to die is gain.[/b]

22 "But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labor: yet what I shall choose I wont not.

23 "For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to [b]depart, and to be with Christ[/b]; which is far better."


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Joe Auvil

 2006/8/15 1:52Profile
MSeaman
Member



Joined: 2005/4/19
Posts: 772
Michigan

 Re: Death, and then what?

2 Corinthians 5:6-8

6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.


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Melissa

 2006/8/15 9:30Profile
murdog
Member



Joined: 2006/2/4
Posts: 352
Fort Frances, Ontario

 Re:

Members,

"For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first." 1 Thessalonians 4:16

Who are the dead in Christ the scripture is speaking of?

Murray


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Murray Beninger

 2006/8/15 9:42Profile
beenblake
Member



Joined: 2005/7/26
Posts: 524
Tennessee, USA

 Re: Death, and then what?

Hey Murray,

There are some things that God has made known to us by way of the Spirit in us. For instance, our life in Christ. Other things are not so clear. I say this to let you know that I am offering a suggestion to your question, but I myself do not have a definitive answer. Here is my offering:

Luke 23:43(NAS)
And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise."

Notice that Jesus does not say "Heaven." Rather, He says "Paradise." I suppose many people assume He is speaking of Heaven. However, this may shed some light on the topic:

The greek words used here is "Paradeisos" which according to the Greek lexicon based on Thayer's and Smith's Bible Dictionary, the definition is:

1. among the Persians a grand enclosure or preserve, hunting ground, park, shady and well watered, in which wild animals, were kept for the hunt; it was enclosed by walls and furnished with towers for the hunters
2. a garden, pleasure ground
3. the part of Hades which was thought by the later Jews to be the abode of the souls of pious until the resurrection: but some understand this to be a heavenly paradise
4. the upper regions of the heavens. According to the early church Fathers, the paradise in which our first parents dwelt before the fall still exists, neither on the earth or in the heavens, but above and beyond the world
5. heaven

From what I understand, and I could be wrong, the Jews believed in three heavens. There is the sky (from the ground to the atmosphere), the universe (outer space), and the last is the spiritual realm "above and beyond the world". The third Heaven is what we typically refer to as Heaven.

However, the expanse of Heaven is not like earth. There are heavens in Heaven. It is a mansion with many rooms as Jesus said. And so, Paradise is one part of Heaven. This place "Paradise" if you notice above is believed to be the place where saved people go until the time of judgment.

This makes sense when we start to think about what Paul spoke concerning the end of times.

1 Thessalonians 4:16 (NAS)
"For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first."

The trumpet sound marks the coming of Christ. (Matt 24:31)

1 Corinthians 15:51-52
"51 Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed, 52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable , and we will be changed."

At the time of the end, all of us will be given new spiritual bodies that are like the body of Christ when He was resurrected. Until that time, we will be "asleep in Christ." While it is called "asleep", those who are dead awaiting this glorious transformation live in Paradise as spoken about in the scripture above.

I hope this provides some clarity.

In love,
Blake


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Blake Kidney

 2006/8/15 11:16Profile









 Re:

"The dead in Christ" is referring to a physical resurrection. However Paul made it clear that our spirits are with Christ when he said:

2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

At the resurrection I believe we are reunited with our body, however the difference will be that our bodies will be perfect and glorified.

So when the time comes to die, you can be confident that your spirit will go to be with the Lord if you are born again.

And if I'm wrong, and your spirit rests in the grave until the resurrection... so what? You wont know it anyway. But I believe scripture clearly teaches otherwise.

Krispy

 2006/8/15 11:37
beenblake
Member



Joined: 2005/7/26
Posts: 524
Tennessee, USA

 Re:

Quote:
So when the time comes to die, you can be confident that your spirit will go to be with the Lord if you are born again.



Indeed Krispy, I would agree. And truly, isn't this the most important and best part of it.

Jesus said, "with me." We will be with Jesus. Does it really matter where? We are with Jesus and will be forever!!! How awesome is that!!

Blake


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Blake Kidney

 2006/8/16 16:15Profile
Onesimus4God
Member



Joined: 2006/1/16
Posts: 226
Chapala, Jalisco, Mexico

 Re:

Beenblake,
At which trump will Christ come again? Is it not the last trump? Does not the last trump occur at the end of the trib? Just curious.

"O"


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Lahry Sibley

 2006/8/16 18:40Profile





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