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Yeshuasboy
Member



Joined: 2006/6/10
Posts: 668
Northern Rockies, BC, Canada

 Willow Creek Leadership Speaker Promotes New Age?

Dear brothers and sisters in Christ,
I just recently came across this story over the internet, and thought I'd start a post to hear comments and concerns regarding this event.
Apparently, some pastors are either not hearing the voice of the Lord, or obeying His commandments and therefore letting wolves into the sheep's den - these wolves are promoting and teaching destructive heresies in supposed Bible-believing churches here in the western world. Is this true? Why are new-age teachers being allowed to promote new-age beliefs in supposed Christ-centered churches? May God grant us leaders in the church who will stand against the wiles of the devil who masquerades as an angel of light(2Cor 11:13-15)...
If this particular story is true, what a great shame indeed that some are deceived into believing that God Himself and sound doctrine are not enough(Rev 22:18-19)What happens to the blind that lead the blind?(Mt 15:13-14)
Link to read for yourself: [url=http://www.fromthelighthouse.com/blog/index.php?s=willow+creek&submit=Go%21]http://www.fromthelighthouse.com/blog/index.php?s=willow+creek&submit=Go%21[/url]
You can also listen to the CrossTalkAmerica, Augest 11, 2006 radio talkshow concerning this event by clicking here:[url=http://67.36.84.226/crosstalk/ct060811.m3u]http://67.36.84.226/crosstalk/ct060811.m3u[/url]
If we donot continually abide in Him, what hope do we have?...For He is our only hope.
The Lord continually blesses His children in many ways :-D
richie


_________________
Richie

 2006/8/12 4:02Profile









 Re: Willow Creek Leadership Speaker Promotes New Age?

Thanks for the headsup, richie.

A very timely post for me to receive. This is hitting very close to home for me and your posted "Alert" I can see as God's provision that, I pray, will help bring repentance.

I was given [by my son] a list of authors to run bio's on, just yesterday. Collins was one of them. This is an answer to prayer for me.

God Bless you,


Orm

 2006/8/12 5:20
OverSeer
Member



Joined: 2006/7/15
Posts: 153
Geneva, Alabama

 Re: Willow Creek Leadership Speaker Promotes New Age?

Quote:
Apparently, some pastors are either not hearing the voice of the Lord, or obeying His commandments and therefore letting wolves into the sheep's den - these wolves are promoting and teaching destructive heresies in supposed Bible-believing churches here in the western world.



Instead of listening to the Lord - many pastors are listening to the voice of "pragmatism." With all this "Seeker-Sensitive" and "Purpose Driven" pragmatic methodology, the church is quickly reaching the state of apostasy that must come first before the Lord comes back. For many, the truth is no longer determined by the Word of God but by "results." And if you can get results by compromising sound doctrine and incorporating worldly but ethical methods - then God must be blessing it and who are we to stand against it - "I'm in favor of [b]any method[/b] that reaches at least one person for Christ - as long as it is ethical" (Rick Warren, [i]The Purpose Driven Church[/i], page 156; emphasis mine). The "Purpose Driven" guru has given his permission to allow pragmatism to be the ruling philosophy and determiner of the truth. Ditto for the "Seeker-Sensitive" guru.

Paris Reidhead said in his sermon [i]Ten Shekels and a Shirt[/i], which was preached in the mid-sixties, "Our day is a day in which the ruling philosophy is pragmatism...if it works it's true, if it succeeds it's good. And the test of all practices, all principles, all truth so-called, all teaching, is do they work?"
http://www.devcobaptist.org/clientimages/31831/excerpt1fromtenshekelsandashirt.wma

"Oh that my head were waters, and mine eyes a fountain of tears, that I might weep day and night for the slain of the daughter of my people!" (Jeremiah 9:1).

Thanks for the link - I have passed it on to others.

Grace and peace
Olan


_________________
Olan Strickland

 2006/8/12 11:18Profile









 Re:

If salvation is the only issue then you may have a point, this is if I'm reading you correctly, but salvation is not the only issue at stake.

There is a also a journey that begins after salvation. What that journey is all about and how to travel the road that leads you to your destination IS the issue. In the new church thinking even the destination has changed ... if even mentioned at all.

Orm

Quote:

OverSeer wrote:
Quote:
Apparently, some pastors are either not hearing the voice of the Lord, or obeying His commandments and therefore letting wolves into the sheep's den - these wolves are promoting and teaching destructive heresies in supposed Bible-believing churches here in the western world.



Instead of listening to the Lord - many pastors are listening to the voice of "pragmatism." With all this "Seeker-Sensitive" and "Purpose Driven" pragmatic methodology, the church is quickly reaching the state of apostasy that must come first before the Lord comes back. For many, the truth is no longer determined by the Word of God but by "results." And if you can get results by compromising sound doctrine and incorporating worldly but ethical methods - then God must be blessing it and who are we to stand against it - "I'm in favor of [b]any method[/b] that reaches at least one person for Christ - as long as it is ethical" (Rick Warren, [i]The Purpose Driven Church[/i], page 156; emphasis mine). The "Purpose Driven" guru has given his permission to allow pragmatism to be the ruling philosophy and determiner of the truth. Ditto for the "Seeker-Sensitive" guru.

Paris Reidhead said in his sermon [i]Ten Shekels and a Shirt[/i], which was preached in the mid-sixties, "Our day is a day in which the ruling philosophy is pragmatism...if it works it's true, if it succeeds it's good. And the test of all practices, all principles, all truth so-called, all teaching, is do they work?"
http://www.devcobaptist.org/clientimages/31831/excerpt1fromtenshekelsandashirt.wma

"Oh that my head were waters, and mine eyes a fountain of tears, that I might weep day and night for the slain of the daughter of my people!" (Jeremiah 9:1).

Thanks for the link - I have passed it on to others.

Grace and peace
Olan

 2006/8/12 11:34
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re: Willow Creek Leadership Speaker Promotes New Age?

Hi. Coming from a person who went to the conferance. I'd like to point a few things out.

Jim Collins wasn't saved. Peg N. had no clue how to speak 'Christianese'. Bono is a rock star. Ashish is a Harvard professor.

Now, some of you with a very quick judgemental spirit will be saying 'Yes, more reason to not like this conferance'.

But, I say that's full of crap. Has any of you ever went to college? A secular one if that? Well, if ur being so critical with this, then I think you should throw out your Bacholer's degree, because you learned it from 'unsaved' people. That goes for any degree.

And, I can hear it now, others will say 'but this is about God's kingdom', hmm.. Not really. The principles of the kingdom easily apply to life. (Sow-Reap, Treat everyone as u want to be treated)

And, Christ NEVER threw a stone at someone. And that EASILY looks like that in this thread.

It's funny, how people feel they need to 'stand up ' for truth. When they don't realize GOD is in control, not them.

To say you can't learn from someone is a PROUD spirit/attitude.

If you don't believe that, think of your kid telling you 'you dont know what ur talking about'. Or how bout an employee back talking you.


My review of this conferance, was that it wasn't perfect. But, this was the MOST influencial conferances I've ever been to in my life. I've been to alot of 'power' conferances, alot of teaching, but BY FAR this is greater.

It's funny also, that you judge and say this is a 'seeker-sensitive' thing. Ha, I really don't think you were there. Because one pastor said 'If your not willing to expose sin, then you need to leave your job as a pastor'.

Always remember the simple pharse 'When you point a finger at someone, you have 3 pointing right back at you.'

 2006/8/12 18:12Profile
OverSeer
Member



Joined: 2006/7/15
Posts: 153
Geneva, Alabama

 Re:

Quote:
If salvation is the only issue then you may have a point, this is if I'm reading you correctly, but salvation is not the only issue at stake.



Quote:
There is a also a journey that begins after salvation. What that journey is all about and how to travel the road that leads you to your destination IS the issue. In the new church thinking even the destination has changed ... if even mentioned at all.



Salvation and discipleship (the journey that begins after salvation) are inseparably linked together. "Enter through the narrow gate (true salvation through the true gospel); for the gate is wide (false salvation through a false gospel) and the way is broad (false discipleship) that leads to destruction (destination that IS the issue), and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small (death to self and sin; love of self, love of money, and love of pleasure cannot come through - true salvation) and the way is narrow (true discipleship) that leads to life (destination that IS the issue), and there are few who find it" (Matthew 7:13-14).

Pragmatism says that if it works (if it gets people through the gate) it must be right, therefore methods don't matter. The problem is: which gate does worldly and unscriptural methods bring people through? And the gate that a person comes through determines the path which he or she takes because the narrow gate doesn't open to the broad way nor does the wide gate open to the narrow way.

Pragmatism causes people to judge by appearance - by the results - and then it opens the door for all kinds of destructive heresies - that is how false teachers are creeping in unnoticed and secretly introducing destructive heresies - they are hiding behind appearance and making pragmatism the standard for truth instead of God's Word. Then anything goes as long as it is working.

Grace and peace
Olan


_________________
Olan Strickland

 2006/8/12 18:33Profile









 Re:

Quote:

lovegrace wrote:
Hi. Coming from a person who went to the conferance. I'd like to point a few things out.

Jim Collins wasn't saved. Peg N. had no clue how to speak 'Christianese'. Bono is a rock star. Ashish is a Harvard professor.

Now, some of you with a very quick judgemental spirit will be saying 'Yes, more reason to not like this conferance'.

But, I say that's full of crap. Has any of you ever went to college? A secular one if that? Well, if ur being so critical with this, then I think you should throw out your Bacholer's degree, because you learned it from 'unsaved' people. That goes for any degree.

And, I can hear it now, others will say 'but this is about God's kingdom', hmm.. Not really. The principles of the kingdom easily apply to life. (Sow-Reap, Treat everyone as u want to be treated)

And, Christ NEVER threw a stone at someone. And that EASILY looks like that in this thread.

It's funny, how people feel they need to 'stand up ' for truth. When they don't realize GOD is in control, not them.

To say you can't learn from someone is a PROUD spirit/attitude.

If you don't believe that, think of your kid telling you 'you dont know what ur talking about'. Or how bout an employee back talking you.


My review of this conferance, was that it wasn't perfect. But, this was the MOST influencial conferances I've ever been to in my life. I've been to alot of 'power' conferances, alot of teaching, but BY FAR this is greater.

It's funny also, that you judge and say this is a 'seeker-sensitive' thing. Ha, I really don't think you were there. Because one pastor said 'If your not willing to expose sin, then you need to leave your job as a pastor'.

Always remember the simple pharse 'When you point a finger at someone, you have 3 pointing right back at you.'



Jim Collins isn't saved, thats a known fact. Did anyone witness to him? Naah! The didn't happen but he did witnessed to you, right?

Speaking of sin: In Jesus, what could anyone like a Jim Collin's say that could in anyway contribute to your spiritual well being except introduce you to an evil one??!. Seems your irrationalism is having its way with you. If your church is growing because of the Jim Collin's that are out there promoting processes and models be advised you are not growing a church of Jesus Christ. The Church of Jesus Christ is a slow growth Church.

Orm

 2006/8/12 19:40
Chariot
Member



Joined: 2006/1/12
Posts: 57


 Re:

Quote:
It's funny, how people feel they need to 'stand up ' for truth. When they don't realize GOD is in control, not them.



lovegrace, if you truly believe this, why did you post?? What was the intention of your post??

Jude 3 Dear friends, although i was very eager to write you about the salvation we share, i felt i had to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints.

Seems to me that God uses his saints to sound the alarm on wolves who wear sheeps clothing. The initial poster was doing just that.

I dont see how any of this is 'funny' considering the Bible is replete with passages saying that wolves would invade God's flock.

 2006/8/12 20:15Profile
Compton
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732


 Re:

Quote:
Jim Collins wasn't saved. Peg N. had no clue how to speak 'Christianese'. Bono is a rock star. Ashish is a Harvard professor...Has any of you ever went to college? A secular one if that? Well, if ur being so critical with this, then I think you should throw out your Bacholer's degree, because you learned it from 'unsaved' people.



Church and secular college...Interesting comparison. Isn't that Yeshuaboy's concern for starting this thread...concern how secular and Holy Spiritless the church is becoming?

Quote:
Because one pastor said 'If your not willing to expose sin, then you need to leave your job as a pastor'.



I'm curious how these pastors plan on exposing sin when they invite unbelievers to teach at their conferences. This is the problem today...we might still use biblical language but we place our confidence in secular business methods, and care about humanistic interests.

MC


_________________
Mike Compton

 2006/8/12 21:56Profile
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re:

Brothers and sisters, why can't you see your sin? I am guilty of it from time to time, but the evidance is clearly shown by your words. If you haven't, read this thread, please do so.: [url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=11804&forum=35]Your sin[/url]

I can't say nothing more than that now. God won't let me. Please I plead with you, take some alone time between you and God and calm down and seek Him about this matter. You don't have to, I'm not your Daddy, but please strongly consider this advice.

 2006/8/12 22:20Profile





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