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"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

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 Re:

Quote:
You wrote that they "had such hostility to the preaching". Brother, I've listened to your audio files, I think that they counterreacted to your hostility...


This is very true that it is [b]easy[/b] to get a reaction, I could out on the street and offend people very easily and provoke them, this is not the true persection that the early church recieved, but rather recieved it under preaching the simple message of the cross, not naming sins in public and other scenario's of depraved lifes. I have read the Acts of the Apostles 10 times in the last month and I just don't see it.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2006/6/20 10:30Profile
hmmhmm
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Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991
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 Re: 5 Points Against (Inappropriate Dressing) edit

if man or woman dress in a way that people look at that person in a lustful way, then that person is a tool of the devil , arent they?


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CHRISTIAN

 2006/6/20 10:33Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

Quote:
I have read the Acts of the Apostles 10 times in the last month and I just don't see it.



We were at the park Sunday afternoon and one of the helpers was telling a man that he needed Jesus Christ or he was going to hell. She was doing her best to reach this young man and soon we all realized that the young man had almost no idea what she was talking about. He had never had any real experience with religion at all. He believed in a 'higher power' but that was it. He tried to commit suicide with a gun under his chin. The gun misfired. One of the guys asked him if he thought about God at that moment, he said, No. What did you think about? "I was speechless", he replied.

I am starting to feel like sometimes we try to push too hard with too much for the sake of time, when an explaination of what is being said, would be much more beneficial. Lowering the tone and allowing the Spirit to lead us to explain to the folks so that God can take those words and make it revelation to their mind and hearts. This takes 'time'. A heavy down-pour just runs off the hardened land. A bomb does speedily what a shovel could do more precisely if there were more 'time'.

I realized that folk need an explaination of what God's word says so that it is clear to them what He requires of them. Sound bite answers are limited in their effectiveness, because the people need a good understanding of what is being said. This takes some time. Maybe not hours, but it does take some time.

Look at Stephens messages in Acts. That message took like a whole chapter or more. It was concise, but it brought tremendous understanding. The people could not resist the wisdom. There is much more to this than just getting up with that message, but I think we can glean something from Stephens method.

God is constantly checking me on my delivery methods in teaching, preaching, and writing. I think this is as important as our content. It is what James calls the wisdom that comes down from above. I need to do this and God is leading me constantly to that end. I am not there, but I am trying to get there. It don't mean I'm not sincere or even hearing from the Lord or 'anointed' as its said. It is a constant refining towards a more Christ like delivery of God's words. God's word in God's way.




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Robert Wurtz II

 2006/6/20 11:10Profile
KingJimmy
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Joined: 2003/5/8
Posts: 4419
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 Re:

Quote:

This is very true that it is easy to get a reaction, I could out on the street and offend people very easily and provoke them, this is not the true persection that the early church recieved, but rather recieved it under preaching the simple message of the cross, not naming sins in public and other scenario's of depraved lifes. I have read the Acts of the Apostles 10 times in the last month and I just don't see it.



In 1 Corinthians, the apostle Paul said it was the preaching of the cross that offended, not the super-colorful use of language to describe sins. One's ability to use adjectives never won anybody.


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Jimmy H

 2006/6/20 11:33Profile
WACKHIMTONY
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Joined: 2005/9/23
Posts: 10
Reading, UK

 Re: 5 Points Against (Inappropriate Dressing) edit

If I was at that lake with my friends I'd definately be dropping the don't worry not all Christians are like that line. Sorry.


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Pete

 2006/6/20 12:35Profile
ccchhhrrriiisss
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Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4499


 Preach the cross...

Hello...

I heard someone once say, "[i]You don't have to teach sinners about tithing[/i]." Regardless of whether or not you believe in a concept of tithing, the point it quite clear -- we don't have to waste our time teaching precepts that will be rejected (or simply misunderstood) by unbelievers.

Please don't get me wrong -- I totally agree with the [i]Hell's Best Kept Secret[/i] message by Ray Comfort. Sinners need to be aware that they are sinners. But is a message on "the dangers of indecent clothing" necessary to people that are quite satified with such clothing? Besides, the greatest sin in this world is the fact that the people of Earth have forgotten their Creator. We were created to fellowship with God. Free will was given so that we could choose Him despite all of the lusts and desires of this world. Yet now, people are completely satisfied without Him -- even to the point of questioning His very existence.

There was a preacher that came to our campus a couple of years ago. He began preaching at a highly trafficked place on campus (between the Student Union Building w/cafeteria and the library). Huge crowds gathered to listen. Unfortunately, the opportunity was (in my opinion) squandered. This man publicly called many of the young women in the crowd very offensive names (vulgar synonyms of 'prostitutes'). When he saw men with hair that he felt was in need of a trim, or he saw men wearing earrings, he labeled them as being the same as "homosexuals" and "sodomites." Sadly, he even publicly slurred some believers for such "sins" as wearing sunglasses or baseball caps. He constantly preached for several days against the evils of freemasonry, communism, roman catholicism, birth control pills, "modern" dress, as well as a few specific vulgar topics that I don't feel that I should type.

Occasionally, this man did say some very good things. But they were constantly mingled with his attempts to publicly offend the listeners. For instance, he shared his testimony (which was wonderful). But then, he would turn around and publicly mock sinners, half-hearted believers and true believers alike. He condemned me as a "heretic" for owning an NIV translation of the Bible. He condemned a friend for being a member of the University baseball team (on scholarship). Why did he do this? Perhaps he wanted to use this as a "gimmick" that would attract passerbys. Perhaps he did this for the "martyr" effect (he was openly ridiculed, mocked and threatened with arrest). Or perhaps he felt that what he was saying was needed in a public forum.

As a result of some things he said, this man was almost attacked by some of the listeners. He was asked to move about 25 yards to the designated "free speech" area (a much more visible location), but he refused. After being threatened with arrest by the University Police Department, he finally moved. He continued to preach for several days. Even though he condemned our Chi Alpha Christian Fellowship organization as a group of heretics (since he affiliated us with a belief in tongues), he thanked us in his newsletter for coming to his defense when he was threatened with arrest (and when an offended person threatened him with a brick). I asked him why he didn't ask for a permit or directions for the designated "free speech" areas on campus, and he said that he was simply another John Bunyan (refusing to cooperate with the desires of heathen governments).

I truly believe in street preaching. But sometimes, I call into question the methods of some street preachers. The opportunity to preach in a public arena is wonderful. But should we spend our time and words on doctrinal persuasion and offensive remarks? If a person wants to truly "offend," then why not simply preach the cross of Christ? It is completely offensive -- but it is also the power of God unto salvation!

May God raise up fellow preachers that are bold enough to preach to the highways and byways like brother Jesse. And may God fill each of them with the words to speak that will bring their listeners to Christ!

:-)


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Christopher

 2006/6/20 12:50Profile
brentw
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Joined: 2005/12/14
Posts: 440
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 Re: Preach the cross...

Another interesting subject....

I'll shoot straight here with you all...

My mother in-law said just the other day if you go to a beach or beach water park the women leave nothing to imagine!

She's right!! Most of the women are just plain naked! SODOM!!

I do like what Jesse said earlier that its just fancy underwear....I like what he said because I have preached it from my pulpit in church. We need to call it what it is!! Like Ravenhill said we use nicer words to cover it up...

The problem isnt with the sinners.... its with those who call themselves christian. Ravenhill said in his interview "you can't preach holiness these days, you cant preach modesty".

Now preaching to sinners on the street about bikinis is for me creating a bunch of "DONT'S". Get them saved and then disciple them! Teach them modesty.

"All is vanity" I wish preachers would preach it from the pulpits! We need to call it what it is!

There, I said my peace

;-) ;-)


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Brent

 2006/6/20 13:39Profile
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Joined: 2004/10/13
Posts: 2132


 Re:

I think the main point is that in street preaching we have to rember who we are preaching to. This is what I mean, Jesus had hard rebukes for the religious community of His time, The jews. Occassionally He happened across a gentile and there were several ways He handled those situations, rember though that those gentiles sought the Lord out. Paul on the other hand reasoned with the greeks as well as the unbelievers with persuasive arguements, much like a lawyer does in court cases before a jury. Jesus came to judge the world ....but how did He judge? He healed the lame, cast out demons, opened blind eyes, proclaimed the acceptable year of the Lord, presented the gospel. Probably had about 6 hours of prayer to one sermon, and than it was time to minister to the needs of the hearers. Don't become a carbon copy of Ray Comfort. And at all times learn to show your genuine love and concern for those you preach to, as if they were your very own children.


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D.Miller

 2006/6/20 15:15Profile
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Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37186
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

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 Re:

Brother Robert what you wrote is worthy of a re-read . It is truly some wisdom gained by your years of walking with Christ, thats not to say we can't preach to people straight and hard at times but truly what you said needs to be practiced more by all of us and I am sure we would see more fruit.

Quote:
We were at the park Sunday afternoon and one of the helpers was telling a man that he needed Jesus Christ or he was going to hell. She was doing her best to reach this young man and soon we all realized that the young man had almost no idea what she was talking about. He had never had any real experience with religion at all. He believed in a 'higher power' but that was it. He tried to commit suicide with a gun under his chin. The gun misfired. One of the guys asked him if he thought about God at that moment, he said, No. What did you think about? "I was speechless", he replied.

I am starting to feel like sometimes we try to push too hard with too much for the sake of time, when an explaination of what is being said, would be much more beneficial. Lowering the tone and allowing the Spirit to lead us to explain to the folks so that God can take those words and make it revelation to their mind and hearts. This takes 'time'. A heavy down-pour just runs off the hardened land. A bomb does speedily what a shovel could do more precisely if there were more 'time'.

I realized that folk need an explaination of what God's word says so that it is clear to them what He requires of them. Sound bite answers are limited in their effectiveness, because the people need a good understanding of what is being said. This takes some time. Maybe not hours, but it does take some time.

Look at Stephens messages in Acts. That message took like a whole chapter or more. It was concise, but it brought tremendous understanding. The people could not resist the wisdom. There is much more to this than just getting up with that message, but I think we can glean something from Stephens method.

God is constantly checking me on my delivery methods in teaching, preaching, and writing. I think this is as important as our content. It is what James calls the wisdom that comes down from above. I need to do this and God is leading me constantly to that end. I am not there, but I am trying to get there. It don't mean I'm not sincere or even hearing from the Lord or 'anointed' as its said. It is a constant refining towards a more Christ like delivery of God's words. God's word in God's way.



Brent wrote:
Quote:
do like what Jesse said earlier that its just fancy underwear....I like what he said because I have preached it from my pulpit in church. We need to call it what it is!! Like Ravenhill said we use nicer words to cover it up...

The problem isnt with the sinners.... its with those who call themselves christian. Ravenhill said in his interview "you can't preach holiness these days, you cant preach modesty".


Brother I agree this needs to be preached [b]to Christians[/b] but why are we trying to preach it to heathen? they don't know any better its just a fruit of their depravity. All your quotes and what Ravenhill is saying is towards the church! for the church not to act like the world. We need to preach CHRIST to people, to present Him Crucified, there is no way for people to realize the way they are living is wrong until they see the Cross and what Jesus did for them. Again show me anywhere were people's paticular sin is pushed in their face boldy! that is not how the apostles or Christ Himself preached. But that does not mean they did not have earnestness. But a strange thing I have seen under the sun, preaching on hell without tears, preaching judgement on sin, and the sickness of sin without tears.

"For [b]many walk[/b], of whom I have told you often, and no tell you even WEEPING, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things."
-Philippians 3:18-19


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2006/6/20 15:30Profile









 Re:

One doesn't need tears if cheap grace is the message. i.e., confess His name and your are ok for heaven.

:-(

 2006/6/20 16:20





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