SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Promoting Authentic Biblical Christianity.
Looking for free sermon messages?
Sermon Podcast | Audio | Video

Discussion Forum : General Topics : Not again

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( 1 | 2 | 3 Next Page )

Joined: 2006/3/20
Posts: 235
fredericksburg, Virginia

 Not again

Just thought you guys would like to take a look at what Iran is doing now!!!

The end is near! PRAISE GOD!

Iran letter precursor to war?
Analysts say it follows Muhammad's instructions for jihad

Posted: May 11, 2006
1:00 a.m. Eastern

© 2006

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad (courtesy Radio Netherlands)

Some Middle East observers believe Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's letter to President Bush could be a precursor to war, based on a traditional Muslim pattern of offering acceptance of Islam before establishing it by force.

Robert Spencer, editor of Jihad Watch, says Ahmadinejad appears to be following the teachings of Muhammad, who gave specific instructions to followers as they engage in "holy war" against "those who disbelieve in Allah."

In a Hadith, regarded by Muslims as sacred writings about Muhammad, the Islamic prophet says a series of offers should be made to "enemies" to embrace Islam, or at least accept Islamic rule, and if they are rejected, "seek Allah's help and fight them."

In his letter, Ahmadinejad argues only Islam can "overcome the present problems of the world" and asks Bush, "Will you not accept this invitation? That is, a genuine return to the teachings of prophets, to monotheism and justice, to preserve human dignity and obedience to the Almighty and His prophets? Mr President, History tells us that repressive and cruel governments do not survive."

Another observer of Islam, journalist Stephen Adams, said the letter seems to parallel a missive from al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden to Americans prior to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

Interviewed on the Michael Medved radio show yesterday, Adams noted bin Laden stated his grievances against the United States and gave Americans the opportunity to "repent."

Based on precedent, Adams continued, he expects the next step will be for Iran to make the invitation public. Then the "crimes" of the U.S. will be published and the grievances will be cited at Friday prayers in mosques. Finally, comes a fatwa, amounting to a declaration of war.

Adams, associate editor of Citizen magazine, said it's possible this scenario could unfold in a matter of weeks.

In a column for WorldNetDaily, Middle East analyst Laura Mansfield said she believes the letter could be a "last warning."

Mansfield says the question must be asked: "Why deliver such a letter when there is little chance it will result in policy changes for either country?"

Like Spencer and Adams, she points out: "Islamic theology documents that no attack can be carried out in jihad without first offering the 'unbelievers' the opportunity to 'repent' and accept Islam. Only when that overture is rejected can an attack occur."

The Iranian president has made clear, at least to audiences at home, Tehran's ultimate intentions.

As WorldNetDaily reported in January, Ahmadinejad told a crowd of theological students in Iran's holy city of Qom that Islam must prepare to rule the world.

"We must believe in the fact that Islam is not confined to geographical borders, ethnic groups and nations. It's a universal ideology that leads the world to justice," Ahmadinejad said Jan. 5, according to Mehran Riazaty, a former Iran analyst for the Central Command of the Coalition Forces in Baghdad.

Ahmadinejad, who drew global attention for his contention the Holocaust was a "myth," said: "We don't shy away from declaring that Islam is ready to rule the world." Two months earlier, he threatened to "wipe Israel off the map"

Riazaty, in a post on the website Regime Change Iran, said the Iranian president emphasized his current theme that the return of the Shiite messiah, the Mahdi, is not far away, and Muslims must prepare for it.

According to Shiites, the 12th imam disappeared as a child in the year 941. When he returns, they believe, he will reign on earth for seven years, before bringing about a final judgment and the end of the world.

Ahmadinejad is urging Iranians to prepare for the coming of the Mahdi by turning the country into a mighty and advanced Islamic society and by avoiding the corruption and excesses of the West.

"We must prepare ourselves to rule the world and the only way to do that is to put forth views on the basis of the Expectation of the Return," Ahmadinejad said. "If we work on the basis of the Expectation of the Return [of the Mahdi], all the affairs of our nation will be streamlined and the administration of the country will become easier."

Matt Kroelinger

 2006/5/11 15:59Profile

Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4781

 Re: Not again

Also the Taliban are beginning to take over southern Afghanistan.

In Christ

Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/11 16:03Profile

Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732


I can't say I share your enthusiam here fellas. Iran is trying to get ready for the return of it's warlord prophet like in the days before Gengis Khan...only this time they have nuclear weapons. The scenario is out of some "B" science fiction movie.

If Muslims and Christians are jumping for joy at the prospect of armmegeddon...can we blame the world for fearing and hating religion? Do we not see how we are contributing to the evil in this world when we start looking forward to World War III?

Libera me, Domine, in die illa tremenda. Dies illa, dies irae, calamitatis et miseriae.


Mike Compton

 2006/5/11 18:30Profile

Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA


If Muslims and Christians are jumping for joy at the prospect of armmegeddon...can we blame the world for fearing and hating religion? Do we not see how we are contributing to the evil in this world when we start looking forward to World War III?

Amo 5:18 Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end is it for you? the day of the LORD is darkness, and not light.

Came to mind earlier, even if it does apply differently in it's context. I may be thinking of an entirely different verse here, but must concur with you MC.

Mike Balog

 2006/5/12 1:01Profile

 Re: Not again

Libera me, Domine, in die illa tremenda. Dies illa, dies irae, calamitatis et miseriae.

[i]Liberate me, O God, - - - - ?

? - - ? - - calamity and misery....[/i]

Help me out, please?

 2006/5/12 6:22

Joined: 2006/3/20
Posts: 235
fredericksburg, Virginia


Come on fellas,

You obviously are making something out of this that there doesnt need to be.

I am excited for the Lords return, The bible tells us to look up, because our redemption draws near.

I am not obviously referring to death and destruction to the world, that I am not excited for many of my family members that arent saved, and friends.

Please dont cause division when it is not necessary. You guys knew what I was referring to.

God Bless

Matt Kroelinger

 2006/5/12 8:43Profile

Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4781


Brother Mike wrote:

If Muslims and Christians are jumping for joy at the prospect of armmegeddon...can we blame the world for fearing and hating religion? Do we not see how we are contributing to the evil in this world when we start looking forward to World War III?

This reminds me of this Scripture...

Is. 66:4 So will I choose their delusions,
And bring their fears on them;
Because, when I called, no one answered,
When I spoke they did not hear;
But they did evil before My eyes,
And chose that in which I do not delight.”

And also...

9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

The delusions come because we do not love the truth. The war you speak of may come, and His will will be done. Yet what is the outcome for those who love God?

Psalm 66:

7 He rules by His power forever;
His eyes observe the nations;
Do not let the rebellious exalt themselves.
8 Oh, bless our God, you peoples!
And make the voice of His praise to be heard,
9 Who keeps our soul among the living,
And does not allow our feet to be moved.
10 For You, O God, have tested us;
You have refined us as silver is refined.
11 You brought us into the net;
You laid affliction on our backs.
12 You have caused men to ride over our heads;
We went through fire and through water;
But You brought us out to rich fulfillment.

There will be those who will understand this once again..

In Christ

Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/12 9:54Profile

Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4781


Prov. 12:12 The wicked covet the catch of evil men,
But the root of the righteous yields fruit.

This Scripture brings to mind how the Iranians covet the catch of whom they consider evil, just like others covet the catch of those they believe to be evil. As Brother Mike spoke, there seems something wrong with all of this.

But what does the second part of this verse say?

But the root of the righteous yields fruit. What we are experiencing today is the absence of fruit...

In Christ

Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/12 10:02Profile

Joined: 2004/3/24
Posts: 1374


Brethren ...

i don't say this in judgment (for i'm included), but in a kind of sad amazement ... But isn't it funny how quickly we saints can come at odds with one another on so many biblical texts, subjects, etc ... It's no wonder why we have so many denoms, and even denoms of denoms ... i wonder what it means to be on one accord, i wonder what that feels like ... i guess the one accord that we all share is that Jesus is the only WAY ...

Anyhow bro Mike brought up Amos ... i've done some delving into Amos because it's there that God said that He'd not make a move unless He telegraphed it thru His prophets first, and here's some commentary (Matthew Henry's) on 5:18 and who God was talking to in reference to "wrongly" looking foward to His day of correction ...


1) - A just and severe reproof to those who made light of these threatenings, and impudently bade defiance to the justice of God and his judgments, v. 18.

2) - Woe unto you that desire the day of the Lord, that really wish for times of war and confusion, as some do who have restless spirits, and long for changes,

3) - or who choose to fish in troubled waters, hoping to raise their families, as some had done, upon the ruins of their country;[/b]

but the prophet tells them that this should be so great a desolation that nobody could get by it.

[b]4) - Or it is spoken to those who, in their wailings and lamentations for the calamities they were in, wished they might die, and be delivered out of their misery, as Job did, with passion. The prophet shows them the folly of this.[/b]

Do they know what death is to those who are unprepared for it, and how much more terrible it will be than any thing that can befal them in this life?

[b]5) - Or, rather, it is spoken to those who speak jestingly of that day of the Lord which the prophet spoke so seriously of; they desired it, that is, they challenged it; they said, Let him do his worst; let him make speed, and hasten his work, Isa. 5:19. Where is the promise of his coming? 2 Pt. 3:4. It intimates, 1. That they do not believe it. They say that they wish it would come because they do not believe it will ever come; nor will they believe it unless they see it. 2. That they do not fear it; though they may have some belief of it, yet they had so little consideration of it, and their mind is so intent upon other things, that they are under no apprehension at all of peril from it; instead of having the conscience to dread it, they have the curiosity to desire it. In answer to this, (1.) He shows the folly of those who impudently wished for any of God's judgments, and made a jest of any of the terrors of the Lord: "To what end is it for you that the day of the Lord should come? You will find it both certain and sad; not a thing to be bantered, for it is neither a thing to be questioned whether it will come or no nor a thing to be turned off with a slight when it does come. The day of the Lord is darkness, and not light, v. 18. Shall it not be so? v. 20. Do not your own consciences tell you that it will be so, that it will be very dark, and no brightness in it?'' Note, The day of the Lord will be a dark, dismal, gloomy day to all impenitent sinners; the day of judgment will be so; and sometimes the day of their present trouble. And, when God makes a day dark, all the world cannot make it light. (2.) He shows the folly of those who impatiently wished for a change of God's judgment, in hopes that the next would be better and more tolerable. They desire the day of the Lord, in hopes to better themselves (though their hearts and lives be not amended), or, at least, to know the worst. But the prophet tells them that they know not what they ask, v. 19. It is as if a man did flee from a lion and a bear met him, a beast of prey more cruel and ravenous than a lion, or as if a man, to escape all dangers abroad, went into the house for security, and leaned his hand on the wall to rest himself, and there a serpent bit him. Note, Those who are not reformed by the judgments of God will be pursued by them; and, if they escape one, another stands ready to seize them; fear and the pit and snare surround them, Isa. 24:17, 18. It is madness therefore to defy the day of the Lord.[/b]

Personally as one who talks about and thinks on the day of the Lord a lot, in this setting that boomat has posted i think Amos 5:18 pertains to the #1 & #5 types who desire (as a taunt) the Lord's day to come, with the #2 type right behind them ... i also think that the #2 type desire is one we saints have to really watch out for ...

i'm torn between desiring the day of the Lord to come ... On the one hand i want it because it would finally put an end to all this suffering here on earth, but on the other hand it ends the harvest into the Body of Christ ... It's easy for me to rejoice in the craziness of world events as signs that my deliverance is getting near because i'm saved, but then i lament at the prospect due to all those that are not saved ...

But then all is left up to God and His timing ... None of us know the day or the hour, and even in light of the worlds escalating madness none of us know or can conjecture just how much time is left ... But we ALL do know this, every minute He gives us on this side is another opportunity for us to confess His name before men in urgent harvest of fellow vessels of mercy until the day of our Lord comes ...

[b]i think it even more interesting the following woe at Amos 6;

[1] Woe to them that are at ease in Zion ...
[3] Ye that put far away the evil day, and cause the seat of violence to come near;
[4] That lie upon beds of ivory, and stretch themselves upon their couches, and eat the lambs out of the flock, and the calves out of the midst of the stall;
[5] That chant to the sound of the viol, and invent to themselves instruments of musick ...
[6] That drink wine in bowls, and anoint themselves with the chief ointments: but they are not grieved for the affliction of Joseph.
[7] Therefore now shall they go captive with the first that go captive, and the banquet of them that stretched themselves shall be removed.[/b]

[color=FF0033]Ouch! ... what was then sounds like Laodicea now ... Send us massive Holy Ghost soaked REVIVAL Lord ... PLEASE![/color]

 2006/5/12 10:08Profile

Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA


Hi bootmat and everyone. Great grace be upon us all in hearing and listening and speaking.

In a sort of interesting way, I was glad to see this thread as it answered a question I had after hearing something on the way home last night!

I was standing at the corner waiting to cross the street and noticed as this car passed, the driver was talking to himself? rather excitedly; I could hear this because his window was down. He was saying something to the effect of they are going to, or there's going to be, war now.

Well, that made me wonder of course what he was talking about and he seemed excited about it, in a sort of triumphant way. On the rest of the way home I kept my eyes alert to see if I noticed anything in the news on the tv's as I passed by the stores but didn't see anything. Since the attack in 2001, I have a subtle anticipation of hearing something like that again, at least it is a possibility in my mind.

So when I got home and read this thread, I was confident that this is what the man was talking about. Although I could be wrong on this, I think I remember that the driver had a Muslim style beard.

So this leads me to the two sorts of reactions being discussed about this news.

If this man was indeed a Muslim, then perhaps we see what Compton was referring to in his behavior, which reminds me too of the proverb

....he that is glad at calamities shall not be unpunished.

And then I know and have shared what I feel bootmat was expressing, how we sometimes just want it all to end, for the Lord to return, and all of this madness to stop which I think brother Rahman has expressed also.

Maybe it is true of our day also... that it is the best of times, and it is the worst of times as well.

Peace be with you all in Messiah Jesus.

Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2006/5/12 10:48Profile

Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Privacy Policy