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Discussion Forum : General Topics : wolves in sheeps clothing

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crusader
Member



Joined: 2006/2/22
Posts: 410
Australia:

 wolves in sheeps clothing

one point i am pondering at the moment and trying to expand on in my spiritual understanding is

we have a fleshly body which is always driven to sin and we have a spiritual body which is always driven to God (when we are born again)God knows this and is compassionate towards us when we sin. it is only under firery testing that we see which is the ruling member with in us. if the wolf nature is stronger then your spirit nature then how does the Lord see this if we are covered and justified by his blood.


if we are wolves in sheeps clothing then what are different tools given from God to bind this nature.

any one got their own experiences let me know. i have heard alot of theories in this but i want to expand.

"Fight the Fight and bind the Flight"

crusader


_________________
karl rashleigh

 2006/3/29 9:21Profile









 Re: wolves in sheeps clothing

Ha, well I 'was' goin' to bed.

This one caught me eyeball.

Crusader, Hi - how are ya ?

Those "wolves" are not "sheep" so they aren't "Saved".

Those are the ones that Paul talked about that come "posing as righteous ministers of Christ" from that darn devil.

No theory, but you can't "wear" sheep clothing ... you're either a Sheep or ya ain't.

Have a Swell day in Jesus.
me again

 2006/3/29 9:44
crusader
Member



Joined: 2006/2/22
Posts: 410
Australia:

 Re:

hello

to say that we do not have a wolf nature as christians is to say that we are incapable of sin is it not these members that war with in us? the sheeps clothing is the lords covering over us and his covenant made with us when we are born again is it not. to sacrifice ourselves to christ is to give up what our flesh nature desires and do the will of God?

E.g my flesh desires me to sit down and relax without working yet my spirit tell's me that this is not the will of God nor is it profitable.

i personaly don't see the sheeps clothing as a deception but rather a covering. if i am aware of my wolf nature that stands against God then when i recognize it and it is revealed to me in the word, then i can ask my lord to change me to become more like him.

Question: if the lord lifted his covering of me " would i have the understanding of this world or Gods? For it is through Christ that my eye's are opened and the word is revealed.

Logically this understanding only highlights the Lords rightiousness and his wonderfull glory compared to our fallen state.

like to hear other peoples understanding in this area?


_________________
karl rashleigh

 2006/3/29 11:38Profile
InTheLight
Member



Joined: 2003/7/31
Posts: 2707
Phoenix, Arizona USA

 Re: wolves in sheeps clothing

Crusader,

I believe that Watchman Nee's book The Normal Christian Life may be of much help to you. He deals very specifically with our Adamic nature and how God deals with it through the cross.

Here is a link to a site where you can read this book online or download it in pdf format and print it out...

[url=http://www.ccel.org/ccel/nee/normal.html]The Normal Christian Life[/url]

In Christ,

Ron


_________________
Ron Halverson

 2006/3/29 12:07Profile
crusader
Member



Joined: 2006/2/22
Posts: 410
Australia:

 Re:

thanks i will read it and see what he has to say about the subject. i have read widely in this area but some things just don't match up when putting all the pieces together. I was hoping someone had seen this in a different light to what the norm is.

when looking at my posts i proberbly seem confronting or a bit out there but i know that God reveals his pearls of wisdom to those who study his word and have an ear to hear! so i am on this site to hear and decifer what is from God and what is not?


_________________
karl rashleigh

 2006/3/29 13:10Profile
bluinos
Member



Joined: 2005/2/4
Posts: 78


 Re:

Quote:

if we are wolves in sheeps clothing then what are different tools given from God to bind this nature.

We are Saints not wolves. We are to Hold Captive every thought unto the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are to examine ourselves, are we walking in the Spirit or are we walking in the Flesh.

Quote:

it is only under firery testing that we see which is the ruling member with in us. if the wolf nature is stronger then your spirit nature then how does the Lord see this if we are covered and justified by his blood.

-If the Wolf Nature is “Stonger” then your Spirit Nature then how does the Lord see this if we are covered and justified by his blood?

Just because we are covered with the Righteousness of His Son Jesus, and we are cleansed by his blood from Sin does not give us the licensed to allow this old nature to manifest.

One of the tools given to us is his word. We are in this world but we are not of this world.

When we are trying to convey our thoughts to one another, are we in the Spirit or are we in the Flesh? When we are eager to know what would push a person over board?? Are we in the Spirit or are we in the Flesh.

Quote:

No theory, but you can't "wear" sheep clothing ... you're either a Sheep or ya ain't.

What makes you a sheep, is it your wool? Is it that you are part of a flock? Or is it that you are a partaker of this gift called “Salvation”? Yessss

Question: if the lord lifted his covering of me " would i have the understanding of this world or Gods?

Answer: Both – You were once of this world. You talked, and acted like the world. Now you have an understanding and appearance of his Son understand his kingdom, his ways, his attributes if you will.

 2006/3/29 14:43Profile
beenblake
Member



Joined: 2005/7/26
Posts: 524
Tennessee, USA

 Re:

Dear Crusader,

Before a person is saved, they are a lost sheep. Then, Christ comes and saves them. A wolf stalks sheep in order to devour them. Not all people who are unsaved are wolves seeking to destroy God's sheep. Some are goats (Matt 25:32-33). Goats are not seeking to devour God's people, rather, they just refuse to accept Christ.

A wolf in sheep's clothing is someone who is disguised as a sheep that is seeking to devour God's people. These are people in the Church who do not believe in Christ, who are not saved, that everyone thinks is saved, but are decieved. Such persons would include false teachers or false prophets.

As another note, the Lord's blood doesn't just cover our sins. Jesus said, "You must be born again." (John 3:7) This implies a complete transformation. Your sins are not covered or blanketed. They are removed. They are gone. A person who has been born again is made into a "new creation." (2 Corinthians 5:17)

Quote:
to sacrifice ourselves to christ is to give up what our flesh nature desires and do the will of God?



This is true, but the thing most people don't realize is that only Jesus can do this. Only Jesus has the power to defeat sin and do God's will. That is why Jesus said, "You must be born again." We need Jesus to come down and change us. We need Him to make us into a new person. We need Him to conquer sin in us.

God's part is to do the work. Our part is to trust in Him. This means we give ourselves to Jesus Christ, and let Him work in us. If we try to defeat sin on our own, then we will fail. However, if we call out to Jesus to save us, then we will have victory, not because we have defeated the Devil or sin, but because Jesus our Lord has done so.

There is a huge difference between a covering and a transformation. A covering is external. A transformation is internal. If you are wearing is a covering, then on the inside, you are still a sinful person. There is no change in you. However, if Jesus Christ has entered into you, and is living inside of you, then you are no longer a sinner. You are sin free.

This doesn't mean you will not fall into sin. However, if Jesus is living inside of you, your heart will always be clean. You will never again be a sinner. Jesus is perfect and without sin. If Jesus is living inside the heart of a person, then the heart of that person is perfect and without sin.

Watchman Nee discusses all this in the book Ron suggested in the post above. I would also recommend reading it.

Hope this helps,
In love,

Blake


_________________
Blake Kidney

 2006/3/29 16:03Profile
roadsign
Member



Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3776


 Re: sheep and goats

Quote:
This doesn't mean you will not fall into sin. However, if Jesus is living inside of you, your heart will always be clean. You will never again be a sinner. Jesus is perfect and without sin. If Jesus is living inside the heart of a person, then the heart of that person is perfect and without sin.



Beenblake, I am not entirely comfortable with this statement. It seems that you are taking truth just one notch over the edge. I'd prefer to refer to myself as a sinner saved by grace. Christ within me is sinless, but my heart is far from it. (heart = will)

What does it mean that Christ is within us? Does it not mean that his Spirit is working through us and in us so that we decrease and he increases? I cannot think of a more powerful way to decrease than when we recognize our own bent to faill, and especially those times when we find ourselves falling into the very sin that we thought we were beyond.

Goats:
The difference between goat-ish sinners and sheep-ish sinners is the direction they are facing. Goats have their backs towards the Lord and sheep face the Lord. Goats walk down the path to destruction. Sheep will become more and more Chrislike as they go along.

Impostors
You can't always tell innitially which path the sheep and a sheep-imposter are on - especially when it's easy to wear sheep's clothing, and no one can tell. In fact many like to reward the sheep-imposters with their money, admiration, and allegiance. That's because they are so convinced that the wolf is a sheep.

But eventually it will be obvious:

“… They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.” 1 Jn. 2:19

"To him who overcomes, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life which is in the paradise of God." Rev. 2:7

Diane


_________________
Diane

 2006/3/29 16:43Profile









 Re:

Listen Crusader, you asked about "wolves in sheep's clothing" which is FROM the BIBLE.

I told you they are NOT saved.

If you want to use Bible verses to head off into another direction ---- that ISN'T good.

There are only 4 references to WOLVES in the N.T.
and either we're going to stay with the verse you used and the others with the title "wolves" in it ... or we're doing the PLAYDOUGH thing with Jesus' words.

You are talking about our "flesh" Biblically ... that we all deal with ... but we are NOT wolves.

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Mat 10:16 Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves.

Luk 10:3 Go your ways: behold, I send you forth as lambs among wolves.

Act 20:29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.

:-?

 2006/3/29 19:13
W_D_J_D
Member



Joined: 2006/1/13
Posts: 119


 Re: wolves in sheeps clothing

ummmm. what???

this post really tripped me out. ok.

Firstly....no Christian can be both a sheep and a wolf. no Christian can be both a sinner and a saint. no Christian can be both dead and alive. no Christian can be continuing to sin and ceasing from sin. no Christian can be saved and not saved.

Jesus said to the adulterous wmone "go ye and sin no more" NOT go and try not to sin.

John says that a Christian ceases to sin in the epistles. Paul says to "live godly in this present age" (Titus 2)

etc. etc.

Be not decieved by these teachers who say "peace peace" when there is no peace. These false prohets are inward wolves, not sheep.

God bless u all!

 2006/3/29 21:48Profile





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