I agree. It is not merely about being like-minded but being one in a Body whose mind is Christ. And that includes all types of people all over the world. God builds his Church completely differently than we view kingdom building.
There is only one body of Christ. He does not have many little bodies here or there. There are many churches but they are merely expressions of the one body of Christ.
The Spirit leads us into a conciousness of the One body of Christ and that we are members of His body and members one of another. And whatever we do, we do as members of His one body.
There is One body, one Spirit, One Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father who is over all, through all and in all.
| 2006/3/29 17:29||Profile|
you are attributing those lessons you learned about YOURSELF and now placing me at the "lower" level of spiritual understanding from which you feel you have come and have now risen above.
How do you know the Lord didnt reveal this to her? I get upset when we say : "I'm right your wrong here....or God told ME this" Way to much pride here.
brent, at this point, I've kept quiet for some time, you post these little sometimes sarcastic or mocking little blurbs and take off to the next thread to do the same.
The title here mentions Pack Mentality and much on that is mentioned on page one ... IF YOU READ IT ... but what you've done here is do exactly what we talked about there ... getting in between two people who want to work things out - one on one - together, but you've done EXACTLY what this thread is talking about, in the Negative sense.
You pop on and off of threads with lots of quick short wise cracks. And I don't care who you know here .... I don't like it ... and all the more now that you've gotten between two more people now.
Either you care about the Title of this thread and what it is meant to do on this forum or stay off of this thread with your endless wise cracks and "stirring up".
Hope you see what UNITY is through this.
I hope cindy and diane can take to PMing or emailing ... y'all are good sisters and don't deserve pubic spectator sporting around a good thing happening between us all.
| 2006/3/29 20:41|
You have a PM.
| 2006/3/29 22:14||Profile|
[url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=10052&forum=35&start=0&viewmode=flat&order=0]Can we try again ?[/url]
| 2006/3/29 23:19|
[b][color=666633]The Teaching of Disillusionment by Oswald Chambers
Jesus did not commit Himself to them . . . for He knew what was in man
"Disillusionment means having no more misconceptions, false impressions, and false judgments in life; it means being free from these deceptions. However, though no longer deceived, our experience of disillusionment may actually leave us cynical and overly critical in our judgment of others. But the disillusionment that comes from God brings us to the point where we see people as they really are, yet without any cynicism or any stinging and bitter criticism. Many of the things in life that inflict the greatest injury, grief, or pain, stem from the fact that we suffer from illusions. We are not true to one another as facts, seeing each other as we really are; we are only true to our misconceived ideas of one another. According to our thinking, everything is either delightful and good, or it is evil, malicious, and cowardly.
Refusing to be disillusioned is the cause of much of the suffering of human life. And this is how that suffering happens if we love someone, but do not love God, we demand total perfection and righteousness from that person, and when we do not get it we become cruel and vindictive; yet we are demanding of a human being something which he or she cannot possibly give. There is only one Being who can completely satisfy to the absolute depth of the hurting human heart, and that is the Lord Jesus Christ. Our Lord is so obviously uncompromising with regard to every human relationship because He knows that every relationship that is not based on faithfulness to Himself will end in disaster. Our Lord trusted no one, and never placed His faith in people, yet He was never suspicious or bitter. Our Lords confidence in God, and in what Gods grace could do for anyone, was so perfect that He never despaired, never giving up hope for any person. If our trust is placed in human beings, we will end up despairing of everyone."[/color][/b]
| 2006/3/30 9:04|
| Re: seeing only in black and white|
According to our thinking, everything is either delightful and good, or it is evil, malicious, and cowardly.
There is a word for this. Maybe someone can help me remember it. This is the condition of being only able to see in black and white. Either it's all hunky-dory, or it's all horrible. For example when two people wed, they have stardust in their eyes and are in an illusion. Everything is like a lovely dream. But when the stardust falls out, they see some flaws in their partner. They may very well ONLY see those flaws and forget that human connection involves embracing BOTH - the good and the bad.
The disillusion is part of the painful process of coming into reality - about ourselves and about each other.
Thanks for this reading, Annie.
| 2006/3/30 9:34||Profile|
| Re: illusions|
But the disillusionment that comes from God brings us to the point where we see people as they really are, yet without any cynicism or any stinging and bitter criticism. Many of the things in life that inflict the greatest injury, grief, or pain, stem from the fact that we suffer from illusions
I have to admit, that it makes me angry when I think about the constant perpetuation of these ILLUSIONS - from the mantra of love songs on the radio to the idealistic sermons from the pulpit - all afflicted with a glaring absence of reality, or any help for us when we do find our illusions shattered.
In fact, disillusionment is all too often treated as a sin - probably because it tends to produce messy side-effects. So, the one who can remain in their illusion is regarded as the more "stable" one, while the one who is undergoing the turmoil of shattered illusions is rejected, viewed as the sinful one.
The tendency to reinforce the sickness is most disturbing to me. I would love to show the back door to those who use their influence, position, and power to squeeze everyone into their fairy tale. Please! Leave us alone to struggle through it. And leave your quick-fix bandades at home! You are not promoting unity, but a resemblance of unity! In the end you simply foster dys-unity (abrassiveness, bitterness, gossip etc.)
I wonder how many marriages are broken because of a failure to see the illusions for what they are. I wonder how many leave the church (and God) because they never realize that their high ideal of church is only an illusion, and has never existed in all of history.
| 2006/3/30 10:13||Profile|
Problem is, I studied Psychology for 25 years before tossing it. But the knowledge of what you've read and it's terminologies never fully leave.
There is a "disorder" for every action of man now. With an ICD code and all. Any one of us can take our pick or in this case "Take a number" please.
Psych students do this to each other with their limited education or maturity ... they push off their own fears by labeling others in class with any chosen ICD #.
But when one can see that one has allowed themselves to be appear a fool, to win some, then that's a whole different ballgame.
My favorite quote above is:
"There is only one Being who can completely satisfy to the absolute depth of the hurting human heart, and that is the Lord Jesus Christ."
| 2006/3/30 10:40|
[b][color=669900]Diane, Cindy, Mellisa, and many others ~ Thank you for your contributions to this thread and others and for caring. It's meant a lot. Really.
Jesus prayed in John 17 a prayer that "will" come to pass, but persecution may be the only thing to produce it, it seems. Unity in truth that is and as you all know anyways.
Joh 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
Joh 17:2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
Joh 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Joh 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Joh 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
Joh 17:7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
Joh 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Joh 17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
Joh 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
Joh 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the Scripture might be fulfilled.
Joh 17:13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
Joh 17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
Joh 17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
Joh 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Joh 17:18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
Joh 17:19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
Joh 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Joh 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Joh 17:25 O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
Joh 17:26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Phi 2:2-5 Fulfill ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus
Go with God !!![/color][/b]
| 2006/3/30 18:31|
| Re: Unity vs. Pack Mentality.|
I don't know if this has been posted...
But Tozer said it best,
"Has it ever occurred to you that one hundred pianos all tuned to the same fork are automatically tuned to each other? They are of one accord by being tuned, not to each other, but to another standard to which each one must individually bow. So one hundred worshippers meeting together, each one looking away to Christ, are in heart nearer to each other than they could possibly be were they to become 'unity' conscious and turn their eyes away from God to strive for closer fellowship."
| 2006/3/31 0:33||Profile|