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Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3703
Ca.

 Re:

Yes, It looks like repentance is for babes in Christ. Which is just a natural outcome of the conviction of the Holy Spirit. Jhn 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

Jhn 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Going on to perfection does not require repentance. It requires Love and that is the Love of Christ that is birthed in us. We can do all the right things including repentance at every turn, but "I show you a better way".

1 Corinthians 13:1-3 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

Eight times it say I and we could put repent in front of all of them because repentance is something I do, but it profits me nothing. What is our profit?

hn 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.

Jhn 13:35 By this shall all [men] know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Jhn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Jhn 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Jhn 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Jhn 14:31 But that the world may know that I love the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Arise, let us go hence.

Jhn 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

Jhn 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Jhn 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

Jhn 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Jhn 15:17 These things I command you, that ye love one another.

Jhn 15:19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

Jhn 17:26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare [it]: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.

Hbr 9:26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

So also is our repentance, once to be saved, then after because Love Himself has been born again in us and He is now our life. If you study repentance carefully you will see Satan uses it to put Christ back on the Cross every time we repent. The Church is still being deceived by a lie that was from the beginning, surely if you sin and repent you won't die for God knows you will be just like Him and your repentance is your power.

Rom 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? [shall] tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

Rom 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Rom 12:9 [Let] love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.

Rom 12:10 [Be] kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love; in honour preferring one another;

Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Does repentance keep us from sin? No, but The Love of Christ and the Love we Have From Him, by Him and In Him will. If we sin, let us be honest and just admit we just don't love Him enough to want to change our minds, then if this is repentance, I am all for it. There is a big difference in the Love Repentance of God and the "I" repentance of man. But then it would not be repentance it would be Love.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/3/16 17:13Profile
h2oboy
Member



Joined: 2006/3/12
Posts: 89
Georgia, USA

 Re:

Brother Phillip said:

"So also is our repentance, once to be saved, then after because Love Himself has been born again in us and He is now our life. If you study repentance carefully you will see Satan uses it to put Christ back on the Cross every time we repent. The Church is still being deceived by a lie that was from the beginning, surely if you sin and repent you won't die for God knows you will be just like Him and your repentance is your power."

Brother are you saying that when the Holy Spirit shines a light on my life and exposes a fault or error that I am not to change my thinking and my direction as this will put Christ back on the cross?

How do you define repentance?

I love you brother, help me understand what you mean.
Jeff


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Jeff Smith

 2006/3/16 17:34Profile
h2oboy
Member



Joined: 2006/3/12
Posts: 89
Georgia, USA

 Re:

Brother Logic said:

"For example: The sin that I do is so abomitable and shameful, I only hate it because I do it and not because it is sin."

Brother I see your point conerning sins which the scripture and society say are abominations. But what about the other sins? Not all sins are ugly in the eyes of men.

James 4:17
17 To him therefore that knoweth to do good , and doeth it not, to him it is sin. ASV

My point was God hates sin, but not for the same reason that we hate sin. Sin is to take action that is not based on the voice of God, to not operate in faith. When we act in fear we are acting on a belief in something other than the voice of God. Do we hate our fearful acts as much as murder and fornication? God does not measure sin in degrees. Jonah was just as sinful for not going to Ninevah as David was with Bathsheba. Neither one obeyed God.

The Church has preached hard on the Ten Commandments and people have put forth effort to try to obey these laws. However, do we believe that not waking up 30 minutes early before going to work to read and pray, if the Holy Spirit led us to do that, is just as sinful as stealing? Do we excuse our failure to obey the voice of God as 'no big deal' if it is not something commanded in the Bible?

If Jesus Christ is Lord, then He is Lord of all, not just the things that we want Him to control. If Jesus is Lord of our time at church then He is Lord of our 'free' time. If Jesus is Lord of our tithe then He is Lord of the 90% also. A Lord is a someone who governs and instructs others what to do. His word is law.

I appreciate your zeal to hate that which is an abomination to the Lord. Keep hating sin.

Love in Christ,
Jeff


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Jeff Smith

 2006/3/16 17:57Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3703
Ca.

 Re:

Hebrews 6:4-6 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

This does not say that people loose their salvation because they fall away. It is saying it is impossible to loose your salvation and cannot be renewed again unto repentance. If we sin what does the word say for us to do, not repent but confess and agree with God that what the Holy Spirit is showing us is wrong and we should change, confess not repent, unless you make repentance confession.

Repent and be baptized. Does this mean that every time we sin we are to repent and be baptized again?

In simple confession it is not me that is faithful and just to do the confessing, I am Christs and the Holy Spirit has convicted me of sin, again simple agreement with God is Like when we first believed, I simply believe and God then does the greatest miracle of All, He birthed His Own Son in us. Now that the Son is in us will He leave? Romans 8:33-39 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Fellowship is severed, just like if we sin against a brother or sister or them us, if we don't ask for forgiveness or confess to them or them to us and us forgive then separation in fellowship is stayed upon us and them. That is why we are to forgive as Christ has forgiven us, and confess that they may forgive as Christ has forgiven them. Are we not to forgive a brother even before confession from them. Yes, Just like God in Christ has forgiven us. Again "if we confess, God is faithful" Why is God faithful? Because of what Christ did on the Cross, not because I confess. I am to be faithful to forgive a brother or sister and ourselves as Christ has forgiven and died for me.

Repentance is a good thing but let us go on toward the High Calling In Christ Jesus our Lord and Love as He has Love us. Confessing our sins to one another: Jam 5:16 Confess [your] faults (sin or trespass) one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.

If God is faithful to forgive and cleans from all unrighteousness, (SIN) Are we not to emulate Christ and forgive our brothers and sisters and ourselves, Rom 8:1 [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Repentance is walking after the flesh, Love is walking after The Spirit.


Mat 3:6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.

Mar 1:5 And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.

No Repentance just confessing sins, repentance has already taken place.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/3/16 18:24Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3703
Ca.

 Re:

I have had sin in my life, and the consequences are sometimes more than I think I can handle. The pain and the tears seem to be so strong that my head will burst and I can't take any more and just want to die to get rid of the pain. Well folks every time I have come to this point Christ comes in and my tears of Pain and guilt change to tears of Joy and Comfort. I did not repent, I just agreed with God that my sin is killing me. I did not Change direction or change anything, The Holy Spirit did and allowed me to see how terrible sin really is and then, the condemnation is gone, not by my spirit but by His. This is happening less and less, and sometimes I don't even realize the sin that is being revealed to me, and in the revelation my agreement, not my repentance, is what God wants, then He knows I am depending on Jesus Christ His Son and not myself to cleanse me. The cleansing is overwhelming and complete in Christ. Do I want to repent in my own works of repentance and self change, not for an instant. It is the Christ in me that will change me by the Power of the Holy Spirit and My Fathers Loving discipline.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/3/16 18:55Profile
h2oboy
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Joined: 2006/3/12
Posts: 89
Georgia, USA

 Re:

Brother Phillip what did Jesus mean in Rev 2:5

5 "Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent , and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent." KJV?

Thanks for being patient.
Jeff


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Jeff Smith

 2006/3/16 19:09Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3703
Ca.

 Re:

Ephesus is a very special judgment on a very special Church. Ephesians is considered the High Point in Paul's epistles. It is a very special moving letter, with a higher calling than any other epistle. Example: Ephesians 1:3-6 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

True enough they were saved and sealed. Ephesians 1:12-13 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

All that God gave Paul to give to the Ephesians was of such high calling of all the Love that God is and Christ gave, is most certainly the First Love being spoken of in Rev 2:5. I am still studying Acts and Eph and see when the first Pentecostal Church began with Peter and the Church everybody says they want be like in what they did. Sell everything and all of one mind and going house to house and prospering.

Then comes Acts 6 and the trouble starts and the same church everybody want to be like killed Stephen and Paul appears and things begin to get worse. Finally in Acts 20 the people in Ephesus which Paul call beasts. 1Cr 15:32 If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.

This order to repent is a special order to the Church at Ephesus, I don't think it has anything to do with personal repentance and be baptized at first for salvation. I think this is a changing of east to west in other words from Jewish synagogues to The Body of Christ Church. "I will take away your candlestick" the Church from Ephesus and remove it elsewhere. "It is removal of the candlestick, not extinction of the candle or its light, which is threatened here; judgment for some, but that very judgment the occasion of mercy for others. So it has been. The seat of the Church has been changed, but the Church itself survives. What the East has lost, the West has gained. One who lately visited Ephesus found only three Christians there, and these so ignorant as scarcely to have heard the names of St. Paul or St. John".

Still studying and will share what happens.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/3/17 2:36Profile
jimbob
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Joined: 2005/9/25
Posts: 131


 Re:

Our foundation is repentance from "dead" works.

"Dead" works are ANY works we do seperate from God, we could give our life savings to the poor and that would be a "dead" work if the Holy Spirit is not the motivation behind it. Going to church every Sunday, being an elder on a board, teaching Sunday School, even evangalism and preaching if not done in the Spirit is "dead" works and must be repented of.

Most people probably think of repentance as turning away from the gross sins like adultery, stealing, etc. but repentance is simply turning away from the "I shall be as God" lie that we (through our representative Adam) bought into in the garden of Eden, and submitting to the Lordship of Jesus Christ.

 2006/3/17 5:00Profile
h2oboy
Member



Joined: 2006/3/12
Posts: 89
Georgia, USA

 Re:

Brother Phillip I am so glad that you are studying this thoroughly. You have talked about Ephesus being special but what about Pergamum, Sardis, and Laodecia?

Rev 2:16
16 Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth. KJV

Rev 3:3
3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. KJV

Rev 3:19
19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. KJV

And could you please help me understand what you mean when you say;

"Then comes Acts 6 and the trouble starts and the same church everybody want to be like killed Stephen and Paul appears and things begin to get worse."

Do you mean that Peter, John, Andrew with the other apostles and the believers threw stones and killed Stephen and that the apostle Paul made the church worse by his presence?

I hope you aren't offended by my questions. It is just that what it seems that I am reading is so different from anything else that I have heard on the subject. Love you brother.
Jeff



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Jeff Smith

 2006/3/17 22:12Profile
InTheLight
Member



Joined: 2003/7/31
Posts: 2737
Phoenix, Arizona USA

 Re:

Quote:
No Repentance just confessing sins, repentance has already taken place.



Hello Phillip. I wonder if repentence might be a way of life for the Christian rather than a one time thing?

Perhaps the Old Testament might help illustrate this. In 2 Chronicles 30:27 you will see that the priest and Levites arose and blessed the people and their voice was heard by God. This is empahsized because previously their prayers had not been granted. Why? Because the prayer hindernace was removed in verse 15 "the priests and Levites were ashamed and sanctified themselves". Through repentence and cleansing spiritual authority was restored.

According to divine law only a priest who was cleansed at the bronze basin could enter into the sanctuary. Similarly, we can only carry out our priestly ministry with power and authority if we cleanse ourselves daily before interceeding, coming to Jesus in repentence, expressing our shame, publicly if necessary, and being cleansed by His blood.

Also, when we see God's actions and judgments in the light of the truth we will say with righteous Job;

I have heard of thee by the hearing of the ear: but now mine eye seeth thee. Wherefore I abhor myself, and repent in dust and ashes.
(Job 42:5-6)

In Christ,

Ron



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Ron Halverson

 2006/3/18 0:14Profile





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