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mblawrence
Member



Joined: 2006/2/10
Posts: 3


 Gaither topic

First of all, we need to ask ourselves this question- Which approach will lead others to Jesus? It does say in the Bible that homosexuality is an abomination unto God, but it also says lying lips is an abomination unto God. If any of you out there says that they have not lied well then you just committed an abomination unto God. Church, there is a whole mission field in the gay and lesbian community that will not be reached unless we, as the Body of Christ, reach them. How will any of them see the error of their ways unless they are around the healing presence of a loving Church. We need to stop expecting people to be holy in order to be a part of the Church. God is a big God and he that began a good work in you will be faithful to complete it. We are all works in progress, so have a little patience and stop being such Pharisees.

 2006/2/11 12:30Profile









 Re: Gaither topic

There is recent thread on this topic in the forum. I would encourage you to move this thread to that forum as it's the very same thing. Here is that link:

[url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&order=0&topic_id=9282&forum=35&post_id=&refresh=Go]BILL GAITHER AND GAYS – A NEW LOW IN THE “JUDGE NOT” PHILOSOPHY[/url]

 2006/2/11 14:51
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7443
Mississippi

 Re: Gaither topic

Quote:

mblawrence wrote:
We need to stop expecting people to be holy in order to be a part of the Church.

Sir: I beg of you to provide a verse with its reference to prove your point! I suggest you take any concordance and look up the word 'holy' and read ALL of those references and then come back and tell us what the Bible says about holiness!!!

ginnyrose


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2006/2/11 15:49Profile









 Re:

So I guess you wouldnt have any problem with homosexual pastors, missionaries and evangelists?

Quote:
We need to stop expecting people to be holy in order to be a part of the Church.



What is the "church"? I would recommend you do a study on what that actually means. If you are an unrepentant sinner you are not part of the Body of Christ... which is the church. Does that mean that those of us who are saved dont sin? No... but the difference is that we have the Holy Spirit, which convicts us when we do sin. If you claim to be a Christian and have no conviction of your sins, and continue on in it.. you are not saved.

Holy does not mean sinless. Holy means set apart, seperate.

Krispy

 2006/2/13 8:46
pottershands
Member



Joined: 2006/1/1
Posts: 36
North Carolina, USA

 Re:

What's that sound? pssssst- crack! Oh no, it's the sound of another can of worms being opened.... :-? I hope this doesn't turn into another 17 page arguement! (No, this post isn't directed at anyone in particular. Please don't throw rotten fruit at me!) ;-)


_________________
Melissa

 2006/2/13 10:14Profile









 Re:

There really is no can of worms... scripture is clear. There is only ignorance or ignoring of the commands of scripture.

Just be clear... no one has ever said that we should not befriend homosexuals and make efforts to bring to Christ. Of course we should. But to say that God will use unrepentant sinners (folks who are not saved) in ministry makes God a liar, because He clearly forbids that in His Word.

As far as lying being an abomination, if a believer is caught in lie then he should be dealt with so that he is brought to repentance. Same thing for a believer who falls back into homosexuality (or any other sexual sin). Thats why scripture discusses church DISCIPLINE, but that goes largely ignored today as well. We wouldnt want to offend anyone and risk them leaving the church... right? Let 'em go, I say. I've had to ask people to leave before. It's never easy, but it was needed on several levels.

To obey is better than sacrifice.

Krispy

 2006/2/13 10:46
IRONMAN
Member



Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924
IN HEAVENLY PLACES WITH JESUS

 Re:

bro Krispy
you said

Quote:
What is the "church"? I would recommend you do a study on what that actually means. If you are an unrepentant sinner you are not part of the Body of Christ... which is the church. Does that mean that those of us who are saved dont sin? No... but the difference is that we have the Holy Spirit, which convicts us when we do sin. If you claim to be a Christian and have no conviction of your sins, and continue on in it.. you are not saved.



what sins do you still commit even though now you're saved which you committed before you were saved? if there is even one then by your logic here you would be unrepentant and thus unsaved and i know you're saved. or am i missing something? :-?


_________________
Farai Bamu

 2006/2/13 11:00Profile









 Re: Gaither topic

I think perhaps we might be over shooting the original thread. Let me explain:

Quote:
We need to stop expecting people to be holy in order to be a part of the Church



I believe what the writer is saying(Icouldbewrong) is that he/she believes in holiness, but not the way that he is seeing today, thru legalistic ways. The reason why I believe this is what is being said is the latter part of the post:
Quote:
We are all works in progress, so have a little patience and stop being such Pharisees.


I have come from a United Pentecostal background and holiness to that organization is far different than then what the bible teaches. Perhaps MbLawrence is coming from this point of view, but lacks the ability to use his grammer properly.

I can understand the SI member concerns here, homosexuality is such a big issue that those who are non practicing homosexuals seeking help within a legalistic enviroment may as well forget about mercy, the law will cut him to pieces and I can attest to that experience. So the SI member may be using the word Holy in place of what he sees as legalism in the church. If he has received a true conversion than he does believe in holiness.

My thoughts
Karl

Karl

 2006/2/13 11:02
IRONMAN
Member



Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924
IN HEAVENLY PLACES WITH JESUS

 Re:

bro Krispy

Quote:
As far as lying being an abomination, if a believer is caught in lie then he should be dealt with so that he is brought to repentance. Same thing for a believer who falls back into homosexuality (or any other sexual sin). Thats why scripture discusses church DISCIPLINE, but that goes largely ignored today as well. We wouldnt want to offend anyone and risk them leaving the church... right? Let 'em go, I say. I've had to ask people to leave before. It's never easy, but it was needed on several levels.



but do we deal with believers who lie as we should? i don't think so coz we all lie at some point and oft get caught but that seems to get glossed over if it's noticed at all. i agree we should deal with (in Christ's love) with those who relapse into whatever sin coz guess what, we all do at some point.

bro Frank (appolus) started a thread called "Are you an Adulterer", i think the thread ended up being 4-5 pages long or so, but the one on bill gaither and the 2 or 3 about the end of the spear easily had over 20 pages each. let's say (for arguement's sake that the total for the threads to do with homosexuality are 60 altogether, why is there that preoccupation? why couldn't we have more people speaking out about adultery?of course it should be left unspoken of or undealt with. however adultery and fornication are BY FAR the more prevalent sexual sins in the body of Christ yet we don't have the same fire concerning them as we do homosexuality and that's just hypicritical in the eyes of God. i'm willing to bet that 70-90% of Christians have committed fornication and adultery (even in the heart)or both and these sins are far more destructive to the body as more homes and lives are broken by them. how is it then in the face of alarming teen pregancy rates, kids fornicating at younger and younger ages and doing even more crazy stuff is there very little if any outrage about it?the unbeliever looks at this and says (even though this shouldn't be an excuse not to repent)"forget these hypocrites" we have got to start letting God deal with us instead of running from Him.bro Krispy you know i love you and we disagree on this issue on some levels but i feel burdened greatly of the Lord about all this.

our problem is we like to jump up and down about sins we're not guilty of for whatever reason and we need to REPENT, REPENT, REPENT OR DIE!!!


_________________
Farai Bamu

 2006/2/13 11:26Profile









 Re:

Quote:
or am i missing something?



What your missing is that word "unrepentant". There is a big difference between when a believer sins and repents for that sin because they recognize it as sin... and someone who commits sin but refuses to acknowledge that it is sin. Of course I sin, but I also am aware that when I sin I need to confess it to the Lord and make things right with Him... and whoever I may have sinned against.

Thats the difference.

There are many homosexuals who call themselves "Christians" who believe God accepts them as homosexuals, that it is not a sin... and that God created them that way... and in so doing they justify their sin. And that is what I am addressing.

And it is wrong for church leaders to join hands with this crowd under the guise of "ministry". Just the fact that we even have to have these discussions shows how close to the world's way of thinking the church has become.

If I call homosexuality a sin... even on a forum like this one... I'm either called a hate-monger, or people say "Are you without sin?"

What ever happened to truth?

Krispy

 2006/2/13 11:29





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