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PosterThread
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
""""I changed the word charity which is agape, which is the Love of God which is Christ who gave Himself for us and Loved us.



When one changes Scripture to explain what one is trying to teach others, that one will always fall short of why God gave us the Scripture.

When you replace agape with the name of Christ, you have changed what Paul meant to teach. Chapter 13 is focused on the fruit, the result, and not the source or power that enables one to know and experience agape. Chapter 13 is an exhortation to learn to love and thus it is not meant to be a statement that we already are perfected.

Only those who obey will learn to walk as Christ walks. That is the difference between what you have said and what Paul intended this section of Scripture to convey.

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/24 12:36Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3695
Ca.

 Re:

Love, Christ, and Charity are there and they are all in Christ. I must learn by the Holy Spirit and the Christ that is in me. I can not learn the things of God any other way. If Agape Love which is epitomized In Christ Jesus, and by me making a point that He is Agape Love, then forgive me for making the statement of Charity being Christ.

I know what Paul is teaching in this chapter, I was just going a step further and showing where the love exists and comes from. My love is as dirty rags to God. His Love in me is the only Love the Father wants. If I could have done it on my own, why would God go to the trouble of making me a new creature in Christ Jesus. God knew from the beginning I could not do it by myself. That is why He gave His only Begotten Son on the Cross. It pleased God to suffer Him so we could be redeemed and have the ability to be what God intended me to be. Now I can go on and be a son of God by the Son of God in me.

I did not change scripture, I gave the reason for why Charity is Christ. I cannot add to or take away from the Word. I can only give the interpretation the Holy Spirit Has given. I could put Phillip in place of Charity and it still would be truth because of the Christ in me.

1 Corinthians 13:1 Though I (Phillip) speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity,(Christ) I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

1 Corinthians 13:4 Charity (Phillip) suffereth long, and is kind; charity (Phillip)envieth not; charity (Phillip)vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, All this by the Agape Love (Charity) Christ in me.


For without Christ there is no Agape Love.
In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2006/5/24 14:48Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
1 Corinthians 13:1 Though I (Phillip) speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity,(Christ) I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.



You see, the Corinthians did have Christ and yet they were not growing in love. That is why Paul was exhorting them. The emphasis of Paul's instruction here is quite different from what you interpret and thus imply in this section of Scripture.

We often will call on the name of Christ as the means of salvation, yet many do not see the process that is the result of the means.

Why do we need a High Priest if we are already perfected and dwell in the heavenlies?

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/24 15:10Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3695
Ca.

 Re:

Chapter 13 was put between two chapters on gifts. Paul was giving them understanding of what gifts are for and who gives them. Then in the midst of His teaching he wanted them to know that none of the gifts will produce anything unless Love is in it, and not just brotherly love, but Agape Love, The Gifted One Himself, the love of God, Jesus Christ. No gift of God can be accomplished unless the Holy Spirit give it as He pleases for the upbuilding of the Body of Christ.

This even called a better way than the gifts.
1 Corinthians 12:30-31 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.
That is Chapter 13, The more excellent way. Agape Love by the Christ that is in us, this is the clearness we see in the Mirror. That which is perfect comes.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/5/24 15:25Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
That is Chapter 13, The more excellent way. Agape Love by the Christ that is in us, this is the clearness we see in the Mirror. That which is perfect comes.



The Corinthians were not being conformed into His image, they remained centered on the carnal mind and were spiritually immature. Listen to Paul's warning.

1Cor. 4:6 Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively transferred to myself and Apollos for your sakes, that you may learn in us not to think beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up on behalf of one against the other. 7 For who makes you differ from another? And what do you have that you did not receive? Now if you did indeed receive it, why do you boast as if you had not received it?

1Cor. 4:8 You are already full! You are already rich! You have reigned as kings without us—and indeed I could wish you did reign, that we also might reign with you! 9 For I think that God has displayed us, the apostles, last, as men condemned to death; for we have been made a spectacle to the world, both to angels and to men. 10 We are fools for Christ’s sake, but you are wise in Christ! We are weak, but you are strong! You are distinguished, but we are dishonored! 11 To the present hour we both hunger and thirst, and we are poorly clothed, and beaten, and homeless. 12 And we labor, working with our own hands. Being reviled, we bless; being persecuted, we endure; 13 being defamed, we entreat. We have been made as the filth of the world, the offscouring of all things until now.

1Cor. 4:14 I do not write these things to shame you, but as my beloved children I warn you. 15 For though you might have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet you do not have many fathers; for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.


Paul says not to go beyond what is written. He warns them of their pride. He points out that they have 10000 instructors in Christ, yet they do not have many fathers.

This is why you cannot change the words in Scripture as you have done. Do not go beyond what is written.

Do you hear?

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/25 10:19Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3695
Ca.

 Re:

Yes, father

I am condemned. Jesus still love's me agape love that is. The Love of the Father.

2 Corinthians 13:7-14 Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates. For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth. For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection. Therefore I write these things being absent, lest being present I should use sharpness, according to the power which the Lord hath given me to edification, and not to destruction. Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you. Greet one another with an holy kiss. All the saints salute you. The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/5/26 0:40Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re:

Brother Phillip wrote:

Quote:
I am condemned. Jesus still love's me agape love that is. The Love of the Father.

2 Corinthians 13:7-14 Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates. For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth. For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection.





Brother, you never have to seek for assurance in God's love for you when you continue to learn to hear what the word of God speaks to your heart. As God continues to grow us in the love, by revealing to us the way the word of God, seperates us from the carnal mind and the vain philosophies of this world, we find that the love of the truth overcomes this world.

This truth is found in Christ.

4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith. 5 Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

1Pet. 1:22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart,

Love you Brother...

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2006/5/29 11:27Profile
Logic
Member



Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

rookie wrote:

Quote:
.....we find that the love of the truth overcomes this world.


Could I sugjest a better thing that overcomes this world?

[b]1John 5:4[/b] [color=990000] For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: [b]and this is the victory that overcometh the world, [u]even our faith.[/u][/b][/color]

Love of the truth is what helps us come to salvation. We find out that we are not good and our own righteousness is as filthy rags.

Love of the truth will also keep us from being decieved especialy when God sends a strong delussion:
[b]2Thes 2:10[/b] [color=990000]And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; [b]because they received not the love of the truth[/b], that they might be saved.
[b]:11[/b] And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:[/color]

 2006/5/30 16:18Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3695
Ca.

 Re:

1Jo 4:8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is (agape) love.

1Jo 4:16 And we have known and believed the (agape)love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in (agape) love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

Agape: The Love of God in Christ, Who is ultimate Agape Love in us. "Christ In us the hope of Glory.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2006/5/30 20:55Profile
rookie
Member



Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re:

Brother Logic...

I also posted 1 John 5:4 just prior to your post. Our faith finds its source in the word of God. It is the incorruptible word of God that not only awakens us to our need of a Savior. It is the word of God that also provides what is needed in sanctification and perservance.

Proverbs 2:

6 For the LORD gives wisdom;
From His mouth come knowledge and understanding;
7 He stores up sound wisdom for the upright;
He is a shield to those who walk uprightly;
8 He guards the paths of justice,
And preserves the way of His saints.
9 Then you will understand righteousness and justice,
Equity and every good path.
10 When wisdom enters your heart,
And knowledge is pleasant to your soul,
11 Discretion will preserve you;
Understanding will keep you,

What is said above in Scripture also speaks to the same thoughts spoken of by Paul to Timothy...

14 But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them, 15 and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

2Tim. 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Our faith brings us to walk with the Holy One who gives to us the understanding of righteousness and justice.

In Christ
Jeff


_________________
Jeff Marshalek

 2006/6/1 15:13Profile





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