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CofG
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Joined: 2017/2/12
Posts: 487
Cambodia

 Re:

What God did in Job’s life is clear and not hard to understand factually. We know that God designs and works all things for the good of His children and “all things” in the context of Romans 8:28 is sword, affliction, loss, death, Satanic attacks and suffering . The problem is not that people don’t understand this about God. The problem is they don’t accept “ this” God. It is pride for a finite human with a comparatively minisicule wisdom to reject God as He reveals Himself. Human pride in human value and in human standards of “fairness “ always result in either a judging of God or a rejection of portions of the whole counsel of God’. Ours is only a partial revelation and explanation by God of Himself and His ways.


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Robert

 2020/1/13 18:53Profile
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 Re:

//What God did in Job’s life is clear and not hard to understand factually. //

Right, which is why the book has been debated for hundreds of years.


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Todd

 2020/1/13 19:17Profile
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 Re:

Hi Todd. The facts of what happened are not debated. The why of it is.


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Robert

 2020/1/13 20:20Profile









 Re:

Todd, the word "incited" in Job 2:3 is "moved(st)" in the KJV. Regardless, there is no mention of anger in that verse. Here is how Strong's concordance expansively translates the original Hebrew verb:

Strong’s Definitions
סוּת çûwth, sooth; perhaps denominative from H7898; properly, to prick, i.e. (figuratively) stimulate; by implication, to seduce:—entice, move, persuade, provoke, remove, set on, stir up, take away.

KJV Translation Count — Total: 18x
The KJV translates Strong's H5496 in the following manner: persuade (5x), move (5x), set on (2x), stir up (2x), away (1x), entice (1x), provoked (1x), removed (1x).

 2020/1/14 8:27
savannah
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Joined: 2008/10/30
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 Re: God and the accuser wager over Job's life




Questions: Here are some of God's questions to Job, to me, to you, to your friend with questions, and to all who've been created in His image.

Job 38:2,3 40:2,7-9

Now brace yourself like a man. I will question you, and you teach me the answers. Now gird up your loins like a man, and I will ask you, and you instruct Me!

Will the faultfinder who contends with the Almighty correct Him?
Do you God's accuser, have answers?
Who is this that darkens counsel by words without knowledge?
Will you accuse Me of injustice?
Will you condemn Me to justify yourself?
Do you have power like God's?
Can you thunder with a voice like his?
(read chapters 38-41 for the whole)
______________________

Don't gloss over these questions with a mere glance! These are God's questions we must reckon with.

If you cannot answer as Job does, you must go back to square one. Because the fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom. And no answers to any of our questions will be to our satisfaction.

"Behold, I am insignificant; what can I reply to Thee? I lay my hand on my mouth. Once I have spoken, and I will not answer; Even twice, and I will add no more.” Job 40:4,5

Will you add more? If so, prepare yourself for the frustration! You will ever be as this man in the OP who, "...is asking a lot of questions that show he is doubting who God is."

No one was ever meant to be able to give answers to such questions as these which we're faced with in Job.

Who God is! Ah!... Is that not at the root? I quote the following, not to place this man in the OP in the category of wicked men, but to make us all consider what is at the heart of all of our perceptions of providence.

"Wicked men would have God to be any thing but what He is; nothing that God is really and truly pleaseth them." - J. Owen

Here's the best answer:

"Worship God." Revelation 22:9

Not an image you've erected in your mind, otherwise known as an imagination. Otherwise known as an idol.

“Woe to the one who quarrels with his Maker— An earthenware vessel among the vessels of earth! Will the clay say to the potter, ‘What are you doing?’ Or the thing you are making say, ‘He has no hands’? Isaiah 45:9

‘Now see that I, even I, am He,
And there is no God besides Me;
I kill and I make alive;
I wound and I heal;
Nor is there any who can deliver from My hand. Deuteronomy 32:39

 2020/1/14 8:42Profile
CofG
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 Re:

Here are some answers from the Holy Spirit about suffering for doing good that Job did not receive.

From that time Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.
And Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him, saying, "Far be it from you, Lord! This shall never happen to you." But he turned and said to Peter, "Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man." - Matthew 16:23

Sometimes those closest to you have their minds set on worldly and temporal concerns and not on the eternal ultimate things of the Kingdom and the purposes of God for you in ushering in that Kingdom. They want you to have the same temporal focus and concerns they do. Their motives aren’t evil but their concerns are against the will of God for you and even against the goal of God for His Kingdom. Like Peter, God must work on them and in them to change their point of view.

Here is Peter’s changed perspective that Jesus worked in him:


In this you rejoice, though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been grieved by various trials, so that the tested genuineness of your faith-more precious than gold that perishes though it is tested by fire-may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ. - 1 Peter 1:6-7

Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery trial when it comes upon you to test you, as though something strange were happening to you.
But rejoice insofar as you share Christ's sufferings, that you may also rejoice and be glad when his glory is revealed.
If you are insulted for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. - 1 Peter 4:12-14


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Robert

 2020/1/14 18:02Profile
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Joined: 2011/10/21
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 Re: brother Robert

I couldn’t agree more 🙏🏻
The book of Job is in many ways the most anomalous and in other ways the most relatable...
When we are temporally minded it (the book of Job) will surely give us fits
Tho when we are focused in eternity the opposite is true,... we even find comfort in the fellowship of suffering-

Recently the Lord showed me another application/interpretation of “if the eye be single” passage that could be applied to Job-

If our eye (vision) is focused in eternity - we will see Gods goodness and as such our whole body is filled with the light of eternity:)
If our eye (vision) is split- vacillating between eternity and temporal then we get confused and will become increasingly self focused and as such we become unfaithful to God as we walk in darkness-
If we believe we have light (faith) while we walk in darkness then it becomes a great difficulty for us to see we are in darkness (deception) because we are unlikely to seek/receive what we think we already have-

(For me) this summarizes the 3 different positions of Job, his wife and his friends...
Job was able to withstand these trials because his eye was set in eternity and not in time,... on the giver and not the gifts,... and then at the end we read “I had heard of you with the hearing of the ear, but now I see you with the seeing of the eye and I abhor myself and repent in dust and ashes”

Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Job proved himself pure in heart and indeed he saw Him 🙏🏻😇



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Fletcher

 2020/1/14 20:34Profile
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 Re:

Nonetheless, the clear text of Job 2:3 says that Satan incited or moved God to destroy Job.

This, despite James 1:13 saying God cannot be tempted by evil nor does He tempt anyone.

The plain reading of Job is that Satan came into the presence of God and goaded God into letting him attack Job and his family. There is no indication at all that God intended to assail Job absent Satan’s goading.

Even if Satan lost the “big” wager as to Job’s ultimate response, he STILL won because he could kill and destroy and inflict one of God’s favorites, which of course is what he loves to do.


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Todd

 2020/1/15 7:11Profile
Sree
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Joined: 2011/8/20
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 Re:

Quote:

Even if Satan lost the “big” wager as to Job’s ultimate response, he STILL won because he could kill and destroy and inflict one of God’s favorites, which of course is what he loves to do.




Wow, going by the same logic, Satan WON on the calvary, because he was able to even KILL, destroy and inflict one with whom God was well pleased! Let us then rewrite all the scriptures that says Jesus defeated satan on the cross!

If this is true, then we are all doomed! No hope of salvation. Praise God it is a lie, Satan was defeated on the cross,.


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Sreeram

 2020/1/15 9:19Profile
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Joined: 2012/2/8
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 Re:

Exactly Sree. You made my point. Something does not add up in the narrative in Job as it is written.


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Todd

 2020/1/15 9:55Profile





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