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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Spirit, Soul, Body?

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StirItUp
Member



Joined: 2016/6/4
Posts: 941
Johannesburg, South Africa

 Re:

Hi Robert,

Thanks for your response.

May I ask this and receive a straightforward, clear and simple answer that children can understand, please?
From anyone who contributes here

In light of this parable and the consistent teaching of scripture:

Will there be the righteous and the unrighteous at the end of the age?
Will some people be saved and many not?
Are the seeds sown by the enemy talking about unsaved (wicked) people and will they ultimately perish?
What will be burned as tares at the end of the age (if not the wicked)?

Thanks,


_________________
William

 2018/12/31 6:04Profile
CofG
Member



Joined: 2017/2/12
Posts: 292
Cambodia

 Re:

StirItUp, Scripture is clear about how God sees people. These are obviously very disturbing texts to many people, including myself. He loves all, but we need to see His black and white view of the world in the right light.


The one who commits sin is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. -- 1 John 3:8 (CSB)

Everyone who has been born of God does not sin, because his seed remains in him; he is not able to sin, because he has been born of God -- 1 John 3:9 (CSB)

This is how God’s children and the devil’s children become obvious. Whoever does not do what is right is not of God, especially the one who does not love his brother or sister. -- 1 John 3:10 (CSB)

Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, because I came from God and I am here. For I didn’t come on my own, but he sent me. Why don’t you understand what I say? Because you cannot listen to my word. You are of your father the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. -- John 8:42-44 (CSB)

He replied: “The one who sows the good seed is the Son of Man; the field is the world; and the good seed — these are the children of the kingdom. The weeds are the children of the evil one, and the enemy who sowed them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels. Therefore, just as the weeds are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will gather from his kingdom all who cause sin and those guilty of lawlessness. They will throw them into the blazing furnace where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine like the sun in their Father’s kingdom. Let anyone who has ears listen. -- Matthew 13:37-43 (CSB)



_________________
Robert

 2018/12/31 6:16Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 492
Australia

 Re:

Hi William,

Let us leave the Parable of the Tares aside for the moment.

You wrote:
“You seem to be pushing for something not found throughout God's Word, that is, that ALL will eventually submit to Christ and be saved. Where do you get this from as the plain reading of scripture indicates the opposite?”


Can you give SCRIPTURAL refutations of my posts?



_________________
Jade

 2018/12/31 7:19Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 492
Australia

 Re:


Hi Ron,

Will think about what you wrote and give a reply.


The Sydney New Year Fireworks will start soon.

Wishing all a blessed New Year in Christ.



_________________
Jade

 2018/12/31 7:23Profile









 Re:

William I don't think that it is possible to answer your questions so that a child could understand them. The parable was given to Israel and the explanation was given in private to the Apostles when they asked the Lord why He had begun to speak in parables.

It is only in that context that the parable makes sense. If we want to ask will some people perish at the end of the age, then we can say yes. If that is the ambition then we don't have much to say. In which case the parable has no benefit or meaning because otherwise how would we obey the command not to sift the wheat and the tares? Wouldn't winning people for Christ sift them unto eternal life? And that is the great commission.

The parable is not about the church. It is about the kingdom and it is set at the time when Jesus spoke it and specifically came about because of the Pharisees blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

This is the prophecy that was being fulfilled.

“He said, “Go, and tell this people:
Keep on listening, but do not perceive;
Keep on looking, but do not understand.’
“Render the hearts of this people insensitive,
Their ears dull,
And their eyes dim,
Otherwise, they might see with their eyes,
Hear with their ears,
Understand with their hearts, And return and be healed.”
Then I said, “Lord, how long?” And He answered,
“Until cities are devastated and without inhabitant,
Houses are without people
And the land is utterly desolate,
“The Lord has removed men far away,
And the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land.” Isaiah 6:9-12

The only element of the parable that exceeds that boundary, is the element which tells us that at the end of the age the angels will separate the tares and burn them. So from that element at least you could say that the tares will be burned.

 2018/12/31 8:44
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 492
Australia

 Re: CofG


Hi Robert,

You said:
“He loves all, but we need to see His black and white view of the world in the right light.”


Thought:

God gave a glorious rainbow with the full spectrum of beautiful colours.

Gen. 9:8-17 (NASB) –
Then God spoke to Noah and to his sons with him, saying, “Now behold, I Myself do establish My covenant with you, and with your descendants after you; and with every living creature that is with you, the birds, the cattle, and every beast of the earth with you; of all that comes out of the ark, even every beast of the earth.
I establish My covenant with you; and all flesh shall never again be cut off by the water of the flood, neither shall there again be a flood to destroy the earth.”
God said, “This is the sign of the covenant which I am making between Me and you and every living creature that is with you, for all successive generations; I set My bow in the cloud, and it shall be for a sign of a covenant between Me and the earth. It shall come about, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the bow will be seen in the cloud, and I will remember My covenant, which is between Me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and never again shall the water become a flood to destroy all flesh. When the bow is in the cloud, then I will look upon it, to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth.”
And God said to Noah, “This is the sign of the covenant which I have established between Me and all flesh that is on the earth.”

Rev. 4:2-3 –
Immediately I was in the Spirit; and behold, a throne was standing in heaven, and One sitting on the throne. And He who was sitting was like a jasper stone and a sardius in appearance; and there was a rainbow around the throne, like an emerald in appearance.



_________________
Jade

 2019/1/1 1:17Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 492
Australia

 Re: CofG


Robert,

Scripture:

Matt. 13:37-43 (NASB) –
And He said, “The one who sows the good seed is the Son of Man, and the field is the world; and as for the good seed, these are the sons of the kingdom; and the tares are the sons of the evil one; and the enemy who sowed them is the devil, and the harvest is the end of the age; and the reapers are angels. So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age. The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness, and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Then THE RIGHTEOUS WILL SHINE FORTH AS THE SUN in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear.

John 8:44 –
You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

Rom. 11:26,28 –
and so all Israel will be saved………from the standpoint of God's choice they are beloved for the sake of the fathers;



Question:

Can the Jews be children of the devil and God’s beloved at the same time?

As children of the devil, surely they are the tares that will be gathered up and burned with fire?

Yet they will be saved because they are God’s beloved.

Will they be burned and through fire become the righteous that will shine forth as the sun?



Note:

God is God of both Jews and Gentiles.

Rom. 3:29 –
Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also,


And God’s covenant with Abraham covers all mankind.

Gen. 12:3 (CSB) –
…………and all the peoples on earth will be blessed through you.

Also, Gen. 22:18, 26:4, 28:14.


_________________
Jade

 2019/1/1 1:20Profile
StirItUp
Member



Joined: 2016/6/4
Posts: 941
Johannesburg, South Africa

 Re:

Hi Jade,

I did not read all the previous posts and don't need to to ask my question as this is something I have picked up in general over the last few posts.

The most famous scripture of all: John 3 16 onwards:"For God so loved the world He have His only begotten Son so that all who believe in Him should receive the gift of eternal life. They that believe will be saved, they who do not believe are already condemned..."

In my humanity, I also would like to think that ALL souls will be saved, that ALL would love God and His Christ
BUT from scriptural evidence as well as historical evidence, is this true?
This is an overused example however for lack of a better: Will Hitler and all the evil men before him, be saved?
If so, on what basis?
They did not love God or His Christ while living as far as we know so what will change when they stand before the judgement seat of Christ?



_________________
William

 2019/1/2 4:51Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5136
NC, USA

 Re:

//This is an overused example however for lack of a better: Will Hitler and all the evil men before him, be saved?
If so, on what basis?
They did not love God or His Christ while living as far as we know so what will change when they stand before the judgement seat of Christ?//

A proponent of Universal Reconciliation would say that post-mortem repentance is possible and the purpose of hell is remedial to bring all souls, ultimately, to repentance. For a resource that answers every objection you can check out tentmaker.org. Obviously you can give as much or as little credence to their arguments as you wish.


_________________
Todd

 2019/1/2 8:46Profile
BranchinVINE
Member



Joined: 2016/6/15
Posts: 492
Australia

 Re: TMK


Let us keep to what the Bible itself says.

I do not know what tentmaker.org teaches and hope this discussion does not deteriorate into a squabble over their teaching.


_________________
Jade

 2019/1/2 9:09Profile





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