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rbanks
Member



Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1330


 Re:

Trying to understand what you are saying brother Marvin...

here is a list of ministers who believed in the Gap creationism.

Religious proponents of the gap creationism have included Oral Roberts, Cyrus I. Scofield, Harry Rimmer, Jimmy Swaggart,[8] G. H. Pember, L. Allen Higley,[4] Arthur Pink, Peter Ruckman, Finis Jennings Dake, Chuck Missler, E. W. Bullinger, Donald Grey Barnhouse, Herbert W. Armstrong, Garner Ted Armstrong, Michael Pearl and Clarence Larkin.

Are you saying these ministers don't believe the whole bible or are not saved?

Just trying to understand...

 2018/6/3 22:47Profile









 Re: I am a young earth creationist is there any other people

I have no problem with a literal reading of Adam's creation being 6,000 years ago, but cannot conclusively dismiss the possibility of a pre-Adamic creation due to some of the Bible passages cited by Dake , Swaggart, Missler & company. Could they be wrong? Sure. But it's interesting to examine the verses they cite.

 2018/6/4 7:42
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7534
Mississippi

 Re: I am a young earth creationist is there any other people

Dominic,

Don't know if this will help you, but will share it...

Our oldest son graduated from MUW in the early nineties with a degree in microbiology. (He had professors that were evolutionist.) He is a creationist, believes in a young earth -and he would agree with you 100%. He came to this conclusion because of his studies in the physical, biological sciences that it proves the creation by God as recorded in Genesis.

God bless.

Sandra


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2018/6/4 10:37Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 6650
NC, USA

 Re:

Once again a person does not have to be a YEC to NOT believe in evolution. The leading Christian proponent of a billions of year old earth DOES NOT BELIEVE IN EVOLUTION.

Automatically equating belief in an ancient earth with a belief in evolution is a RED HERRING and DISHONEST.

Obviously, atheistic scientists believe in an ancient universe AND evolution. They are simply wrong about the latter.


_________________
Todd

 2018/6/4 12:08Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1165
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


I am saying theistic evolution and old earth creationism are compromises to the Faith. Gap-creationism means what?
Are you referring to an alleged gap between Gen 1:1 and 1:2? If so, even the literalists who believe that will not throw the remainder into "poetry" so as to allegorize the creation.

Ive read Pink on creation by way of his commentary on Genesis 1, I think Brother Pink is being influenced by the mounting interest during that time for evolution and was making a way for science ( as the thought ) was helping us understand Genesis 1. We have since found out we didn't need the evolutionists or old earthers to help us with Genesis 1.

Numerous other preachers were compromisers in other areas too. Dake, Bullinger, Armstrong (both of them cultists).

But, Pink goes farther than merely asserting the possibility of a gap between vs 1 and 2.

Brother banks, I am not saying it's my way or the highway, I am saying to endorse old earth, theistic evolution or some other frame theory is a compromise and twisting of the truth. Their salvation is not my call, but their doctrine is my call and I can judge it accordingly.

I don't count Genesis as a minor, I count it as a major. I consider a mistake here so dangerous and so errant those who have any kind of consistent theological understanding will find ways to compromise other areas of the faith to make room for their compromise in Genesis.

Now, there are plenty who compartmentalize everything. In short, they have no consistency to their theology so they are all over the map. Orthodox here, heterodox there, biblical here, heretical there. These folks are a walking contradiction theologically. In effect, they claim biblical inerrancy over here, but fail to actually teach it in authority when the right people are in the room.

These folks remind me of the prophets Jeremiah complained about. They don't feed the sheep with good grass and clean waters...they trample the grass and muddy the water. So it is with compromisers of Genesis 1.

To be an old-earther is to be "in-the-know" as far as a scientifically saavy preacher. They pretend their learning of various scientific theories gain them a good stand with the 'learned' of the day so when they recite these 'learned men', they acquire a notoriety from them and lots of applause from the unlearned audience. Chuck Missler does this very well. His teachings are packed full of present day scientific jargon and theory, but he has stepped away from the plain reading and revelation of Genesis 1.

A Gap in Genesis vs 1 and 2 are not much of an issue, its conjecture. But old earthers need it to get 14 billion years as a settled fact before they poetize Genesis 1.


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Marvin

 2018/6/4 13:43Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 6650
NC, USA

 Re:

//but anybody that doesn't believe every part of the Bible as it is written is not saved and on their way to hell.//

Elijah, not sure how old you are but surely you are not so naive as to make such a statement?

Surely you understand that great heroes of the faith see certain scriptures very differently?

Which ones are you consigning to eternal torment- only those who do not agree with you?

Thank goodness it is God, and not you, who decides the fate of men.


_________________
Todd

 2018/6/4 14:44Profile
savannah
Member



Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2265


 Re: digging deeper into the earth




For any who may be interested in digging deeper into the earth, the best book on the subject, both scientifically and theologically would be, "Creation and Change: Revised and Updated" by Douglas Kelly.

It won't disappoint any who do take the time to read it!

When all is read and done, the one thing that really matters is that He may reveal Himself to you, and that you are drawn nearer to Him, and have a closer walk with Him.

For He is the God of Genesis to Revelation, Who has been and always will be. The Great God and Father of the Lord Jesus Christ. Amen.

 2018/6/4 15:50Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1165
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


Thanks Savannah: I have many books on this subject, but I don't have Dr. Kelly's I'll see about ordering it.


_________________
Marvin

 2018/6/4 16:15Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1165
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


Hi Alec: I never took those who 'gap' Genesis Chapter 1 and 2 seriously. I had a good brother who wanted to write a book on the pre-adamic race. I told him flatly he didn't have any scripture to base it on, only conjecture and the necessary dismantling of a literal interpretation of Genesis 1.
The text of the scripture doesn't intimate it, but I do realize you can isogete until your hearts content on any subject, Genesis 1 is no exception. Over the years I have ran into numerous ones wondering why the seeming differences between Gen chapt 1 and Chapt 2, but it is quickly resolved with simple study.

To get the idea they are 'gapped' you need someone who has a private interpretation that can gain momentum by way of educational notoriety. "Well if Dr. so-and-so says it, it must be good as gold". With that little lie, we are well on our way to 'controversy' and 'debate' and 'scholarly research'...so now the non-scholar cant read Genesis 1 and expect to know what it means. He cannot know what Genesis 2 means either because various scholars have found some obscure text that they claim undoes the greater context contained in the plain reading.

After a time you realize what is being done to you, you are being swindled out of what God is saying and its being replaced with a clandestine entry of a new axiom...namely I need to depend upon man to help me know what God is saying.

When you see it, you cast it out like a devil and treat it as such.

I do the same with those who question the deity of Christ etc.


_________________
Marvin

 2018/6/4 16:38Profile









 Re:

Marvin, as I understood it the gap is supposed to be between Genesis chapter one, verses one and two (not between chapters one and two).

I will cite a Biblical example of a gap that we all agree to exist: when our Lord Jesus went into the temple & began to read from Isaiah about His coming to open the eyes of the blind & to set the captives free He stopped in mid sentence and said, "Today is this saying fulfilled in your hearing." The rest of the verse spoke of His second coming...a gap of almost two thousand years thus far.

Some wonder whom Cain was fearful of when he was made to wander in the land of Nod. His own relatives? The Nephilim? A pre-Adamic race (I don't hold to that view)?

Jeremiah has a passage that the gap theorists love to quote. It involves the destruction of cities followed by a recapitulation of Genesis 1:1-2. Did the devil make a wasteland of an ancient earth prior to the present creation?

That is what they posit. I'm not sold on the concept, but anything that invokes further prayerful study in the Word is a good thing, as I see it. I do not teach these things to others, but I *am* saying that there are Bible mysteries that are not clearly stated. For example, there is a people group called Amalekites in the Bible who lived *before* Amalek. Were they his ancestors? A coincidence of name? So-called because the descriptive words in Hebrew are the same?

 2018/6/4 18:42





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