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| Re: | | Todd, of all the things that have been written on this thread of late, glorifying the living God, that is your question?? Todd, just to be very honest, I have disdain for anyone who would even toy around with even the idea that God created evil, for reasons that are not clear other than some kind of ego trip. Even the suggestion that God could have created evil violates every tenet of Scripture. If one does not or cannot or will not acknowledge that without reservation, then I really have no desire to further engage in a conversation with one who, at least for themselves, are asking rhetorical questions. I will not engage with anyone who has been on the road for a long time and dishonors God with even a mere suggestion that He may have possibly created evil. Now if you were a babe in Christ or a immature saint that would be one thing, but you are neither of those things, nor is this subject non-essential, it is absolutely essential. Instead of asking me these questions Todd, perhaps, with an open Bible, you should get down on your knees and go directly to the throne and ask the Living God some of the things you have asked on this thread. No more comment from me to you on this subject brother, although I am willing to join with other brothers and sisters who magnify and elevate the pure and Living God. May the Lord bless you Todd..............bro Frank |
| 2018/4/25 14:44 | | TMK Member
Joined: 2012/2/8 Posts: 6650 NC, USA
| Re: | | “A person’s character determines how he interprets God’s will (see Psalm 18:25-26). Abraham interpreted God’s command to mean that he had to kill his son, and he could only leave this traditional belief behind through the pain of a tremendous ordeal. God could purify his faith in no other way. If we obey what God says according to our sincere belief, God will break us from those traditional beliefs that misrepresent Him. There are many such beliefs which must be removed– for example, that God removes a child because his mother loves him too much. That is the devil’s lie and a travesty on the true nature of God! If the devil can hinder us from taking the supreme climb and getting rid of our wrong traditional beliefs about God, he will do so. But if we will stay true to God, God will take us through an ordeal that will serve to bring us into a better knowledge of Himself.”
~Oswald Chambers _________________ Todd
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| 2018/4/26 7:21 | Profile | savannah Member
Joined: 2008/10/30 Posts: 2265
| Re: God is Good | |
"...dishonors God with even a mere suggestion that He may have possibly created evil."
God says of Himself,
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
And again He testifies,
Shalt a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?
There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job, and that man was blameless, upright, fearing God, and turning away from evil. Job 1:1
His beloved servant Job, who was surely one who'd not dishonor God,testified;
"The LORD gave and the LORD has taken away. Blessed be the name of the LORD.” Job 1
But he(Job) said to her(Mrs Job), “You speak as one of the foolish women would speak. Shall we receive good from God, and shall we not receive evil?” In all this Job did not sin with his lips. Job 2:10
To the Word and to the Testimony!
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| 2018/4/26 8:27 | Profile | StirItUp Member
Joined: 2016/6/4 Posts: 949 Johannesburg, South Africa
| Re: | | That just put the fox among the chickens! :) _________________ William
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| 2018/4/26 9:04 | Profile | TMK Member
Joined: 2012/2/8 Posts: 6650 NC, USA
| Re: | | Context shmontext :) _________________ Todd
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| 2018/4/26 9:46 | Profile | MrBillPro Member
Joined: 2005/2/24 Posts: 3422 Texas
| Re: | | I don't want to get caught up in the scriptures I have no idea what they really mean, so the simple man just has a question, could evil maybe be storms, floods, fires, etc. I mean those things are pretty evil. I do know God did create Lucifer, I don't think God created Lucifer as evil, but allowed the potential for sin. Also I think, when Lucifer chose to rebel, he instantly became the author of sin. Evil was the result of a free-will choice by Lucifer. This is how the old common sense dude defines the way he interrupts all this. :-) _________________ Bill
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| 2018/4/26 9:55 | Profile | savannah Member
Joined: 2008/10/30 Posts: 2265
| Re: very good | |
Ecclesiastes 7:29
Behold, this only have I found: that God made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.
Genesis 1:31
And God saw all that He had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.
1 John 1:5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
_________________________
No true christian would argue that those verses I quoted in my previous post are a contradiction to those above.
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| 2018/4/26 11:01 | Profile | twayneb Member
Joined: 2009/4/5 Posts: 2256 Joplin, Missouri
| Re: | | I have to agree with Frank here. I do not believe God created evil. God created lucifer, the angels, and man. At his creation he was the anointed cherub and, like all of God's creation, was good. (Genesis 1) Lucifer allowed wickedness in his own heart, deceived man, and the whole of creation fell into sin. (Genesis 2)
I think what often happens is that we settle on a doctrine and then we hurl proof texts to support our doctrine. Exactly the opposite, I believe, of good interpretation.
Savannah referenced Isaiah 45:7 and Amos 3:6. The problem with these scriptures is that we can also find scriptures that seem, very plainly, to contradict those. Savannah posted a few of those as well. 1 John 1:5 among them. I can also add Psalm 5:4 which says God has no pleasure in wickedness, neither shall evil dwell in Him. Also James 1:13 that tells us that God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth He any man.
So either the Bible is extremely contradictory (That is absolutely not the case), or we not understanding what is meant by evil (Which is the only other alternative, so it must be true).
The word evil in the OT is a very broad word. It can range from meaning something that is basically equivalent to wickedness to something that simply means a calamity as in, "Great evil came upon the city when the tornado hit it."
The context of Isaiah 45:7 and Amos 3:6 cannot mean the first, wickedness, because that would directly contradict James 1, Psalm 5, 1 John 1:5. It would also contradict the clear Biblical teaching that God hates wickedness. However, understanding these scriptures to mean that God brought about a calamity upon a city is totally consistent with context both of the passages themselves and the rest of scripture. Look at Jeremiah 19:3 and 15, and Joshua 23:15. Also think about Sodom. God definitely brought evil upon that city. But that in no way implies that God created wickedness.
_________________ Travis
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| 2018/4/26 11:29 | Profile | TMK Member
Joined: 2012/2/8 Posts: 6650 NC, USA
| Re: | | // I do not believe God created evil.//
I do not believe that anyone here disagrees with that statement.
Obviously “evil” in the verses quoted by Savannah mean “judgment” or calamity and there is no doubt God visits that upon persons or nations as He deems necessary. _________________ Todd
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| 2018/4/26 13:54 | Profile |
| Re: | | Travis writes........
"I think what often happens is that we settle on a doctrine and then we hurl proof texts to support our doctrine. Exactly the opposite, I believe, of good interpretation........So either the Bible is extremely contradictory (That is absolutely not the case), or we not understanding what is meant by evil (Which is the only other alternative, so it must be true)."
Amen, I think that was one of the first things I learned in "Survey of theology," class many moons ago. Scripture does not contradict itself. But in the day and age of Wikipedia study and cut and paste debating, much error, and in this case, grevious error is made when looking through a certain doctrinal positional lense or grid and then making Scripture say what you want it to say. This is very much the case in the last two posts..........bro Frank
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| 2018/4/26 16:36 | |
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