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yuehan
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Joined: 2011/6/15
Posts: 510


 Is it God who seeks the individual? Or the other way round?

Is it God who seeks the individual? Or is it the individual who seeks God?

In the parable of the lost sheep (Luke 15:1-6), it is God who goes after the individual who is lost. There's also a similar theme in Ezekiel 34:11.

Yet other verses, such as Hebrews 11:6 and Jeremiah 29:13, speaks of the individual searching for God wholeheartedly, and thus finding Him. Even in the parable of the prodigal son (Luke 15:11-32), it is the son who returns home to his father (though I'm not sure if this parable is meant to be taken so literally in this aspect).

1. What do you think? Scripture references, testimonies...

2. If you were at the pulpit, would you emphasize God seeking the individual, or the individual seeking God?


 2017/3/10 9:31Profile
TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5388
NC, USA

 Re: Is it God who seeks the individual? Or the other way round?

Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance? Rom 2:4

I think this applies to your question- but not sure exactly how.


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Todd

 2017/3/10 10:13Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: Is it God who seeks the individual? Or the other way round?

"There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."

"Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins."

"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

"And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:"

 2017/3/10 10:35Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5388
NC, USA

 Re:

I think God draws us, and pursues us even; it is up to us whether or not to pursue Him back.

At a time in my youth when I was backsliding pretty good God always always pursued me. I never felt abandoned and it was this fact that brought me back where I belonged.

I just heard this song this morning:

Your Kindness
-------------
Waiting for angry words to sear my soul
Knowing I don't deserve another chance
Suddenly the kindest words I've ever heard
Come flooding from God's heart

It's your kindness that leads us
To repentance Oh Lord
Knowing that You love us
No matter what we do
Makes us want to love You too

It's your kindness that leads us
To repentance Oh Lord
Knowing that You love us
No matter what we do
Makes us want to love You too

No excuse no one to blame
No way to hide
The eyes of God have found my failures
Found my pain
He understands my weaknesses
And knows my shame
But His heart never leaves me.

It's your kindness that leads us
To repentance Oh Lord
Knowing that You love us
No matter what we do
Makes us want to love You too

If You are for us
Who can be against us
You gave us everything
even Your only Son

It's your kindness that leads us
To repentance Oh Lord
Knowing that You love us
No matter what we do
Makes us want to love You too


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Todd

 2017/3/10 10:44Profile
Heydave
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Joined: 2008/4/12
Posts: 1306
Hampshire, UK

 Re:

Interesting question.

"No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." John 6:44

"And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father."
John 6:65

On first reading this could seem to say God the Father arbitrarily chooses those who He draws to Jesus. However the context is Jesus speaking to the religious Jews who would not believe, because their hearts were not seeking after God anyway, therefore the Father would not draw them to accept Jesus.

I think it is both us who seek God (even if we don't understand who He is) and God who seeks us and draws those whose hearts He knows seek Him.

"And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;"

"That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:"

Acts 17:26-27


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Dave

 2017/3/10 11:01Profile
savannah
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Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2009


 Re: Is it God who seeks the individual? Or the other way round?




It is as it has always been from the beginning;

Genesis 3

8 And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden toward the cool of the day; and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden. 9 And the LORD God called unto the man, and said unto him: ‘Where art thou?’ 10 And he said: ‘I heard Thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.’

 2017/3/10 11:05Profile









 Re:

Quote: "If you were at the pulpit, would you emphasize God seeking the individual, or the individual seeking God?"
I would emphasize none of the above.

How then can they call on the One they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the One of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone to preach? Romans 10:14

 2017/3/10 14:30
Jasmine
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Joined: 2005/11/19
Posts: 94


 Re: Is it God who seeks the individual? Or the other way round?

Actually I think it can be both. I can remember about a year and a half before I got Saved, I was having what I call “hmmmm experiences”. There were things happening to me that didn't make sense but they gave me pause like “what was that?” but then I'd just move on until the next time and there was always a next time. Things got more intense right before I got Saved. None of it made sense until after I got Saved and looked back over the chain of events or even just the day before. That's when I could see as plain as day, God had been pursuing me. On the other hand when I got Saved one of the things I remember was having a sense of “this is it! I found it (rather Him)”. There was no doubt in my mind that He was who I had been looking for. Before then I was a person who if you asked to go to church, odds are I would accept the invitation. The problem for me was I didn't “see” Him. They could be alright meetings but I didn't “see” Him until He Himself came for me and when He did, I knew it was Him. I had never been Saved before but I knew. I do believe that the timing and things that are beyond my understanding was orchestrated by the Holy Spirit because I didn't know any Scriptures or have any expectations of any kind...

 2017/3/10 16:31Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3699
Ca.

 Re:

Acts 28:28 Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles, and that they will hear it.

Romans 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

They must hear with their ears, see with their eyes what God has shewed them.

It must be of God first then we can hear by the preacher what leads to salvation.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2017/3/11 19:27Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1133
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:

Unsaved people do not seek the God of the bible, if they do seek a god, its one they can work with, one that's amenable to their needs, a god that fits their designs, appreciates their skills, loves their personality, enjoys their opinions. The sinner seeks only a god that will never ever crucify him.
The God of the bible seeks just this exact kind of man. In fact the only kind of man God brings to Christ are those men and women who in their hearts admit they wanted nothing to do with Him. The God of scripture and the god of a sinners imagination are opposite ends of the universe. Now, when a sinner is seeking what he thinks is God and speaks some Christian vernacular, many Christians are fooled and the one that is really fooled is the sinner who believes on a Jesus that is the exact image of the god he imagined.
Only the God of scripture and truth calls a man to die, only a God of truth and life offers himself as a substitute and utterly abominates everything that man will attempt to offer God in the place of complete surrender and dependence upon Jesus Christ.
So, I say as best I understand, If God didn't do the seeking first, finding and revealing of Himself, there would be nothing on the earth representative of himself. Everything would be fashioned after the corrupted heart of man.
Those who truly seek the one True God, already know him by New Birth, they seek him and find him.
Those who are under the instruction of the Spirit of God by means of conviction of sin, righteousness and judgment find the True God...and the cause of it is God's own seeking and obtaining those who will worship him in Spirit and Truth.
What God seeks for in us, He must create in us first, otherwise all God would receive is constant corruption, false worship, false relationships and false understanding of His person.


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Marvin

 2017/8/29 22:54Profile





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