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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Who is Mystery Babylon?

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Jeff, I can go back to many of your posts and show you how you sneak in nasty smears under the guise of not wanting to be contentious, arrogant, proud or harsh. Can't you just deal with the subject without smearing and defaming men?

Let's see what you snuck into this humble post:

"Special Scribes", "Secret Knowledge", "Special Ones", "Fakers", "Few wide-awake ones", "The enlightened ones"?

Your dream was like that. Sneaky, off-handed, backdoor sarcasm and judgments. But it was a "dream" so it must have come from God and not your own mind and emotions filled with frustrations over the topic. Do you really believe the nastiness in that dream came from God? Why do you feel the need to communicate this way?

I was hoping someone would bring this to your attention.

 2016/4/12 13:25


That's funny (or ironic) Julius, cause those quotations for things like "only the wide-awake ones" were actually from the post in Philip Mauros own words? So you're accusing me of "smearing" when I'm just regurgitating the actual words & the ideas of "your guy"?

Do you see a problem with that Julius? Go back & read the post quoting Maurro.

I wasn't trying to be contentious. I was just pointing out his words & the inconsistencies of the view he is espousing. But I guess you can discern some evil intent in me for that?

Anyways, God Bless you Julius,

 2016/4/12 13:36


And the irony in telling me to "play the ball & not the man" when I in fact was & so you "play me" personally & not the ball (& it's just your own guys words, not mine).

That is something psychologists call "confirmation bias". Everyone inherently has it. It's the ones who don't realize they do & deal with it that are the hardest cases & displays of willful blindness from it.

Lord, guard all our hearts from this form of pride

Especially mine. I know what lies in my flesh. No good thing. Have your way in me Lord. And Julius too (😊)

That was a lighthearted joke Julius. You can take a break from scolding me & laugh, it's ok

 2016/4/12 13:39


Yeah, I am laughing. I am laughing how you shrug it off and blameshift back to me.

"Playing the man" and not the ball, is when one turns attention to defaming a man who is trying to talk about a subject or defaming a man that wrote an article because one cannot deal with the content of the article in a mature way.

I am not defaming you. I am bringing to your attention that you are not focusing on the subject at hand, but smearing others who ARE focusing on the subject.

Smearing men is lying about men, I am not lying about you. But, you can't receive it without lying and smearing back at me. Now, that is ironic!

 2016/4/12 14:09


Ok Julius,
Let's just look at it squarely then And "play the ball", ok?

Phillip Mauro said, among other things, (quoting from the thread post):

IT IS CLEAR ENOUGH TO ANYONE WHO PUTS HIS MIND TO IT that an invisible autocracy, which is able thus to place an inflexible price upon the food of men, is really the master of their lives, or "souls". Hence we can clearly see, in the light of the foregoing facts, that the system described in ch xviii, under the symbol of the black horse and rider, has attained to full development in our day...... p.221

This complete domination of the necessities of life of human existence by an invisible system of finance has come so quietly, and so gradually, THAT ONLY A FEW WIDE AWAKE ONES HAVE REALIZED WHAT IS GOING ON; and their voices, when they have sought to cry an alarm, were easily stifled, or drowned out......p.223
-Philip Mauro "Things which must soon come to pass"

So I was just quoting Your guy for HIS WORDS & IDEAS HE IS CONVEYING. Verbatim. Word for word & thought for thought. So if you thought it was nasty, sneaky, & had an agenda, I agree. I get that same check in my spirit when I read Phillip Mauro on this subject too Julius.

And you said to me afterwards (among lots of other slams and impugning my motives as evil, sneaky, sinister & devilish):

Jeff, I can go back to many of your posts and show you how you sneak in nasty smears under the guise of not wanting to be contentious, arrogant, proud or harsh. Can't you just deal with the subject without smearing and defaming men?

Let's see what you snuck into this humble post:

"Special Scribes", "Secret Knowledge", "Special Ones", "Fakers", "Few wide-awake ones", "The enlightened ones"?

Again, I was merely discussing how your guy frames opposition in HIS OWN WORDS & his whole idea/thought process. And you came out directly at me with a bazooka doing what you were accusing me of doing. That is why I mention "confirmation bias" because we can be so adamant to defend a man's position that using his own words & ideas is apparently off limits except for the "few wide awake ones" who really understand what Maurro meant or something?

I don't want to argue with you Julius. I just didn't feel it was right for you to accuse me of doing something I wasn't doing & in turn do that very thing to me. Just Forget it.

God Bless you,


 2016/4/12 14:24


And me stating ahead of time that I'm not trying to be contentious, harsh, arrogant etc. is because I know (from experience and your post that immediately followed just further confirms it) that if you point out flaws, inconsistencies, & especially if you point out his own words as being part of the "few special wide awake ones", it is going to bring out people who are so set on pushing this guys agenda that he himself (by that I mean his own words & all his doctrines) is "above questioning" & so I then MUST BE all those things. How dare I? But even Paul said, "if I, or anyone preach another Gospel than that you have heard....let him be accursed" in Galatians. And the scriptures say "the Bereans were more noble....searching the scriptures to see if these things are true..."

And Jesus of false & good teachers, "by their fruit (Greek word there is "offspring" - what they produce after themselves) you will recognize them.."

But I can't analyze Maurro's words or I must be lets see, "sneaky", "evil", crafty, and what other synonyms for the devil himself were there again? All because I question the way he speaks about this "special knowledge"... & those who disagree & hold to a more traditional view?

 2016/4/12 14:46


Jeff, Oil is not the only thing spoken of in Babylon. It appears from the text that Babylon is a world trade center of these products. And unlike Julious's point the shipmasters are actually just shipmasters.

No one buys this stuff on the list from Mecca

Rev 18:9 “The kings of the earth who committed fornication and lived luxuriously with her will weep and lament for her, when they see the smoke of her burning, 10 standing at a distance for fear of her torment, saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! For in one hour your judgment has come.’

11 “And the merchants of the earth will weep and mourn over her, for no one buys their merchandise anymore: 12 merchandise of gold and silver, precious stones and pearls, fine linen and purple, silk and scarlet, every kind of citron wood, every kind of object of ivory, every kind of object of most precious wood, bronze, iron, and marble; 13 and cinnamon and incense, fragrant oil and frankincense, wine and oil, fine flour and wheat, cattle and sheep, horses and chariots, and bodies and souls of men. 14 The fruit that your soul longed for has gone from you, and all the things which are rich and splendid have gone from you,[e] and you shall find them no more at all. 15 The merchants of these things, who became rich by her, will stand at a distance for fear of her torment, weeping and wailing, 16 and saying, ‘Alas, alas, that great city that was clothed in fine linen, purple, and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls! 17 For in one hour such great riches came to nothing.’ Every shipmaster, all who travel by ship, sailors, and as many as trade on the sea, stood at a distance 18 and cried out when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, ‘What is like this great city?’

 2016/4/12 15:23


People know the difference between someone taking a critical look at a man's teaching and character assassination. Why are you acting so obtuse? (Playing dumb).

Saying that you are not doing this ahead of time does not negate the smearing that then ensues by you. Your disclaimer has no power in and of itself if you violate it. You think we are fools?

Now, you smear him by your backhanded reference to him as having an "agenda".

If you don't like a teaching, it is then labeled an "agenda".

Look, any man's teaching is fair game to be scrutinized by the Word of God. Some people can't contest a teaching with a Berean attitude so they resort to character assassination. Some posters, who do use the Word of God to test a teaching, also have their character assassinated.

What is so difficult about this for you to understand? You are "bobbing and weaving", a lot.

People that can't test a teaching with the Word of God and instead resort to character assassination of the poster or the man or woman behind the teaching ought to stay out of forums until they can.

The reason I am telling you this is that I am under the impression there is some hope for you in learning to communicate without resorting to these tactics.

 2016/4/12 15:32

Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2067

 Re: Ad 70 date

bearmaster said,

"Most conservative commentators hold that the Book of Revelation was written around 90 or 95 A.D. But there are those such as Hank Hanegraaff who hold that the Book of Revelation was written before 70 A D."

Such a statement may be misleading. Just for clarification;

Here are merely a few conservative commentators who hold that the Book of Revelation was written before 70 A D.

F.F. Bruce
Jay E. Adams
W.F. Arndt and F.W. Gingrich
C.C. Torrey
J.A.T. Robinson,
Adam Clarke
Henry Cowles
R.C. Sproul
Jamieson, Fausset and Brown
Leon Morris
James Burton Coffman
Albert Schweitzer
Robert Mounce
Westcott and Hort
Robert Young
Philip Schaff
Augustus H. Strong
Sir Isaac Newton
Alfred Edersheim
Clement of Alexandria

There are many others.

 2016/4/12 16:36Profile


You know Julius....nevermind.

These are your forums bro, it's your world. I'm just an evil squirrel.

You didn't answer any of what I specifically quoted/said, just fell back on accusing me & then adding "I think there's some hope for you"? Wow.

Thanks. I appreciate it.

I don't even know what to say I haven't already (that you refuse to see/address). Yes, I believe Phillip Mauro's teachings/writings CLEARLY have "an agenda". I say that unashamedly, unapologetically, etc. But instead of addressing his own language, the strange borderline heretical views he espoused at the end of his life, how he was DEAD wrong on Israel never being formed as a nation ever again "or we have to question the whole New Testament" (you really avoided addressing that nonsense), etc. you just keep coming at me over and over and over again? And, though some on the forum didn't do it in the right spirit, you wonder why others have said the same of you (concerning agenda).

SI is your forum King Julius. You can have it bro. I cry uncle. Not in false humility, but in seeing it's not beneficial or edifying. I can't question Mauro's actual words, teachings, etc. but you can SLAM me, slander me, accuse my motives, etc. & that's ok, though?

I give bro. I don't want to share where you're involved. I really don't. Have a nice forum.
God Bless,

 2016/4/12 16:37

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