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yuehan
Member



Joined: 2011/6/15
Posts: 510


 Re:

Colossians 2:16-23

"So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in false humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, and not holding fast to the Head, from whom all the body, nourished and knit together by joints and ligaments, grows with the increase that is from God.

Therefore, if you died with Christ from the basic principles of the world, why, as though living in the world, do you subject yourselves to regulations — “Do not touch, do not taste, do not handle,” which all concern things which perish with the using — according to the commandments and doctrines of men? These things indeed have an appearance of wisdom in self-imposed religion, false humility, and neglect of the body, but are of no value against the indulgence of the flesh."


In all seriousness, I find legalism to be a greater stumbling block than any form of addiction.



 2016/2/12 19:16Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2093
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Towards Colossians 2:16-23, the context shows that Paul is referring to the Mosaic Law with all of its ceremonies and rituals and observances of abstaining from certain types of meats and drinks, and the addition of the worship of angels. It has nothing to do with the risk of getting drunk or stumbling others in that way.

Towards legalism, legalism is adding to the commandments of God. I do not see how the scriptures I shared in context are adding to the Word of God.

We can throw scriptures back and forth to support our position, and sometimes it may seem like there is a contradiction in the Word because some scriptures seem to say one thing and other scriptures seem to say the opposite. But we know that the Word of God does not contradict itself. We must seek to be like the Bereans and test everything in light of the whole counsel of God.


_________________
Oracio

 2016/2/12 20:03Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5476
NC, USA

 Re:

Yeah when I posted the OP I did so because I thought it was encouraging that a big name like manning was not ashamed to be identified as Christian. I didn't mean it to become a discussion on how good or bad of a Christian he is or whether he is a Christian at all.

Let's face it - he does live in a world of fame and money and sports where it would be hard to be a Christian. It is not wrong or sinning for him to be a great QB. He was raised in it with his dad before him and his brothers alongside him. I personally believe he has risen above many of the snares and traps that bring so many in his shoes down.

We can pray that his witness will strengthen and that he can influence others around him.


_________________
Todd

 2016/2/12 21:26Profile
yuehan
Member



Joined: 2011/6/15
Posts: 510


 Re:

If I had all power in this universe and used it to turn water into wine, I wonder what kind of criticism I'd be greeted with! (e.g. potentially stumbling others, alcohol having dubious utility, parties are not pious events, I should focus on saving souls and helping the poor instead)

Well, Jesus did just that.

 2016/2/13 1:05Profile
Lysa
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Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3407
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re: Peyton Manning and Christianity


This thread (not the OP), is a perfect example of how "Americanism" has infiltrated the beautiful and wonderful Church of Jesus Christ.

By Americanism I mean, your belief that what YOU believe is absolute and everyone else is wrong; that your version of Christianity is the perfect version.

You know, there are Christian's in England who meet at pubs (neighborhood meeting spots for parents, kids & dogs) and they don't think a thing about having a "pint." There are other Christians round-the-world that drink wine and it doesn't enter their mind that they are "sinning."

God bless us all and allow the Holy Spirit deal with people!!


_________________
Lisa

 2016/2/13 12:59Profile
JHerndon
Member



Joined: 2010/8/1
Posts: 92
Bonifay,Fl

 Re:

Wow it's pretty crazy some of the comments on here. I'm thinking that none of you have met this guy let along know him personally. To declare him not Christian is to me almost like a Pharisee. Can I just encourage us to not be so quick to judge. Especially on an issue like the consumption of alcohol. I do not drink alcohol but I don't condemn those who do. If I'm not mistaken Jesus was called a drunkard?? But all of that to say that you can not determine if Peyton is Christian or non Christian. Thank you for the OP. I love articles that are a mixture of sports and faith. Much love


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Joshua Herndon

 2016/2/13 14:55Profile
Jeremy221
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Joined: 2009/11/7
Posts: 1468


 Re: Discernment

I came across this today and thought it was worthwhile from an informational perspective about Payton Manning. I think some people discerned some underlying issues in his life that others seem to have dismissed.

The video is produced by Cracked, liberal leaning humor and satire magazine/website.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KYO-afZw4JI

 2016/2/15 8:37Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5476
NC, USA

 Re:

Ancient history Jeremy.

"Jesus’ instructions with regard to judging others is very simply put; He says, “Don’t.” The average Christian is the most piercingly critical individual known. Criticism is one of the ordinary activities of people, but in the spiritual realm nothing is accomplished by it... The Holy Spirit is the only one in the proper position to criticize, and He alone is able to show what is wrong without hurting and wounding. It is impossible to enter into fellowship with God when you are in a critical mood... There is no escaping the penetrating search of my life by Jesus. If I see the little speck in your eye, it means that I have a plank of timber in my own (see Matthew 7:3-5). Every wrong thing that I see in you, God finds in me. Every time I judge, I condemn myself (see Romans 2:17-24).

If we are not heedful and pay no attention to the way the Spirit of God works in us, we will become spiritual hypocrites. We see where other people are failing, and then we take our discernment and turn it into comments of ridicule and criticism, instead of turning it into intercession on their behalf. God reveals this truth about others to us not through the sharpness of our minds but through the direct penetration of His Spirit. If we are not attentive, we will be completely unaware of the source of the discernment God has given us, becoming critical of others and forgetting that God says, “…he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death.” Be careful that you don’t become a hypocrite by spending all your time trying to get others right with God before you worship Him yourself.

One of the most subtle and illusive burdens God ever places on us as saints is this burden of discernment concerning others. He gives us discernment so that we may accept the responsibility for those souls before Him and form the mind of Christ about them (see Philippians 2:5). We should intercede in accordance with what God says He will give us, namely, “life for those who commit sin not leading to death.” It is not that we are able to bring God into contact with our minds, but that we awaken ourselves to the point where God is able to convey His mind to us regarding the people for whom we intercede.

Can Jesus Christ see the agony of His soul in us? He can’t unless we are so closely identified with Him that we have His view concerning the people for whom we pray. May we learn to intercede so wholeheartedly that Jesus Christ will be completely and overwhelmingly satisfied with us as intercessors." ~~Oswald Chambers

To summarize, if you discern a weakness in others, don't criticize or judge-- intercede for them!!! That is how God tells us to intercede. I am not sure about y'all but the above statements by Chambers taught me something today.


_________________
Todd

 2016/2/15 10:01Profile









 Re: Judging

We human being make judgments every day. In 1 Thessalonians 5:21 the apostle Paul says “Examine everything carefully, hold fast to that which is good.”
In this verse we are told to use the cognitive abilities we have to say what is good and what is bad, i.e.: to have discernment and to make a judgment call.
For example when we see a a religious leader caught with solid,incontrovertible evidence of misrepresentation, fraud and, deceit we must make a judgement.
When we dis-continue supporting such vile and wicked behaviour
and warn others is not judgementalism but discernment. Big difference.

Judging others is to set ourselves as the standard of right and wrong, Exercising discernment involves looking at the evidence i.e. the fruit or lack thereof and act accordingly.

 2016/2/15 11:36
yuehan
Member



Joined: 2011/6/15
Posts: 510


 Re:

If Peyton Manning were to come across this thread and read the comments, what would he feel?

Well, we can have some idea by conducting a thought experiment. Try substituting your name (or the name of your child) in place of his name.

Would you be encouraged to draw near towards God? Or would you be turned off from Christian community?

There's been concern about stumbling others through our actions. Could some of these comments here potentially be a stumbling block to Manning himself?

 2016/2/15 12:31Profile





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