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 Re:

I was teasing you.....this thread, to me, is utterly fruitless........Peyton Manning drinks a beer, and the forum is up in arms, and we wonder why we don't see revival?....or outsiders view us as uptight hypocrites?

this is not at you personally Jeff.

 2016/2/12 14:55
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1390
Dothan, Alabama

 Re:

Brother Neil,

Ha! You would make a great salesman;) you had me going, so much so I was like, Wow, what is that? And had to look it up! Lol!!!

But yes I def agree with your observations-


_________________
Fletcher

 2016/2/12 15:35Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5485
NC, USA

 Re:

I wasn't sure what raw opium paste was, either. I live a sheltered life. 😇


_________________
Todd

 2016/2/12 15:39Profile









 Re:

Ok. And just FYI - I don't have a problem with believers who in good conscience want to drink a beer or have a glass of wine, nor (more importantly than what I think) do I believe the scriptures. Drunkeness or making weaker believers stumble however are both specifically spoken to in the scriptures very clearly. Often tone and sarcasm/jest are wrongly misinterpreted in written communication, so I just try to be careful, especially since I've been wrongly received more than a few times myself. 😊 God Bless,
Jeff

 2016/2/12 16:12
Oracio
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Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2093
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

Seems like we may have quite a few sipping saints here eh.


_________________
Oracio

 2016/2/12 16:14Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2093
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

This thought came to mind. Is it any wonder that there are so many different denominations? It only makes common sense if we cannot fellowship and co-labor while having these types of serious disagreements, right?

A few years ago I was attending a church where I found out one of the pastors was drinking beers at baseball games with one of the members. This was a church located in the ghetto of Long Beach, CA, where there is much alcohol and drug addiction. I ended up leaving the church after confronting him and lost respect for him. That's just how I see it, sorry. There is too much apostasy going on these days in many churches and this drinking beer stuff is just one of many symptoms of a deeper problem.


_________________
Oracio

 2016/2/12 16:52Profile









 Re:

And FYI, my love for ecstasy got me addicted to heroin pre-Christ, so I didn't find the opium paste "jokes" all that funny, sorry. It's like if someone made a joke about "casually partaking in porn" when millions are addicted to it. Some things are funny (& I have a pretty good sense of humor), & some things aren't, at least to me. God Bless!

 2016/2/12 17:20
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2093
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

T-

You asked where I get the idea of drinking beer and wine possibly being okay in Europe. I believe this passage would apply:

“But beware lest somehow this liberty of yours become a stumbling block to those who are weak. 10For if anyone sees you who have knowledge eating in an idol’s temple, will not the conscience of him who is weak be emboldened to eat those things offered to idols? 11And because of your knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died? 12But when you thus sin against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ. 13Therefore, if food makes my brother stumble, I will never again eat meat, lest I make my brother stumble.”-1 Cor. 8:9-13

From what I've heard, in certain places in Europe beer and wine is so common place that they even put it in many of their foods. And it seems that people there are used to seeing even Christians partaking, and there is no stumbling on account of it. If that truly is the situation there then it may not be wrong for Christians to partake as long as they don’t get drunk. However, caution is still needed because for some even just a small amount can make them start feeling “different” due to the high levels of alcohol contained in each can of beer or glass of wine.

Again, I would argue that in the first century it is likely that it took much more to get drunk than it takes today especially with beer; because if it was as easy to get drunk as it is today, there would be a clear command not to drink at all lest they risk getting drunk.


_________________
Oracio

 2016/2/12 17:45Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2093
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

I want to highlight this portion of the passage in my last post:

"But when you thus sin against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ. 13Therefore, if food makes my brother stumble, I will never again eat meat, lest I make my brother stumble.”-1 Cor. 8:12-13


_________________
Oracio

 2016/2/12 17:47Profile









 brother Jeff

you wrote:

Quote:
And FYI, my love for ecstasy got me addicted to heroin pre-Christ, so I didn't find the opium paste "jokes" all that funny, sorry. It's like if someone made a joke about "casually partaking in porn" when millions are addicted to it. Some things are funny (& I have a pretty good sense of humor), & some things aren't, at least to me. God Bless!



Jeff, before I write to you, my voice is gentle, my spirit is friendly, in NO WAY, am I "speaking" harshly to you.

I grieve that ecstasy and heroin got on top of you, and in the spirit of REALNESS, and authenticity, in the 90's I took ecstasy twice, it bored me, one time I snorted a line of brown heroin,(in the 90's also) a big line, and it had me flat on my back, and that bored me too....and brother I say not to boast in any prior depravity, but I've done ever drug out there, I've looked at pictures of naked women, I have HAD many naked women, unmarried, I have committed adultery numerous times....and yes, I paid for it, because I lost the wife of my youth 16 years ago, and in those 16 years, I have remained alone, I have NOT remarried, my heart is broken, and this aloneness is my contrition, my penalty, and I bear without complaint.

as far as raw opium paste, tonight up here on the ridge, the temp is going down to -15 to -20, with winds up to 40 mph. I don't have a cold or cough now, Thank God, but the cough "syrups" big pharma sells over the counter are just garbage....the only prescription cough syrup that would kill any cold and cough I had IMMEDIATELY was Tussionex Hyperpenkinetic suspension fluid, but guess what?....they don't make anymore, because the Govt,(who's intel agencies are the biggest transhippers of cocaine and heroin in the world) decided that people were "abusing" it....the hypocrisy is so THICK you could cut it with a knife, just like the hypocrisy of the "REV" Jerry Falwell Jr endorsing that trophy of grace, Donald Trump)

in the mid 19th century, all cough medications were made with raw opium paste, in fact, I could make (or might have already made) a cough syrup comprised of 2 parts opium paste, 2 parts honey, and 1 part whiskey....and any cold and cough I have is cured, but the problem is this, both the Govt and Big Pharma, don't get their MONEY, because money is all that's important to them.

and if i'm to be even more transparent, I am positively wearied of seeing threads like this, where some athlete has a beer, and everyone is up in arms....even to the point some posters make snide remarks of who might be sipping alcohol...for the record, I don't drink alcohol....IT"s BORING, just like these countless threads that have NOTHING to do with Revival, only tightly wound brittle religiostic arguments about dashes and tittles, and men falling all over themselves to demonstrate on a forum how "holy" they are, when I know in my spirit, that's just a cover for God only knows what....would to God, followers of Jesus, just be REAL....and in that vulnerability to each other, MAYBE we can be full of love, and hence "a peculiar people", who make outsiders "envious of so great a salvation".

the kids today?, they can see RIGHT THRU the hypocrisy of the "greybeards" of the Church, these "vaunted" preachers, who speak of "Christian Perfection".....or rant about "Strange Fire"....its phony, and we better get our acts together quick.....Sunday services these days?....."rome -lite" and by the clock, man made, man run.

Now if you'll excuse I have to wheelbarrow some more firewood in here. much love, neil

 2016/2/12 19:13





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