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Discussion Forum : General Topics : The Church of Wells Discerning - The Church of Wells Website

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 The Church of Wells Discerning - The Church of Wells Website

Saints,

The Church of wells is a group that has formed that has shown cultish behaviours and using godly preachers from SermonIndex to support their ministry. We have submitted a public statement I made on another thread on the Church of wells on SermonIndex to this website.

You can read part of the About page here:

This website exists in order to make a statement regarding the claims of association with biblical teachers – both historical (John Knox, Thomas Brooks, Richard Baxter, John Bunyan, James Renwick, Matthew Henry, Jonathan Edwards, John Wesley, George Whitefield, David Brainerd, Charles Spurgeon, et al.) and more modern (Arthur W. Pink, A. W. Tozer, Rolfe Barnard, Leonard Ravenhill, Paul Washer, et al.) – made by The Church of Wells in an effort to provide credibility for their ministry.

The Church of Wells uses portraits, links, articles, sermons, and other media from these godly men on its website in an attempt to build for themselves a credibility by association. The only credibility they have attained, however, is a false one. The historic figures to whom The Church of Wells appeals would never have associated themselves with the CoW’s teaching or practice; and some of those who are still living have even requested complete disassociation from the CoW, its ministry, and its website. Unfortunately, such requests have often been denied or ignored.

http://www.thechurchofwells.org/discerning-the-church-of-wells/


Here is a link to the public statements:
http://www.thechurchofwells.org/statements-concerning-church-wells/



Paul washer has repeated a few warnings on twitter about the group, this is unusual for him to do that and also for myself to speak out. I believe it is the mercy of God to these young Elders that God would get a hold of them and show them the error of their ways.


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SI Moderator - Greg

 2014/5/1 1:12Profile
Heydave
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 Re: The Church of Wells Discerning - The Church of Wells Website

I'm sorry but I have a major problem with this website that calls out the CoW. As much as I think the CoW is in error, I also see the people behind the website in error.

Instead of genuinely reaching out to these young folk (who in their zeal have wandered into extremes) and try to understand where they are coming from, they are just pushing them further into a corner with an extreme reaction and disassociation, shouting 'cult'.
The other thing is, this website makes a big issue out of the fact that the CoW believes you can loose your salvation. So they are just pushing their 'Reformed' position and claiming that anyone who believes differently is heretical. There are many men of God (even featured on this site) who believe the scriptures warn repeatedly about the possibility of loosing salvation if you do not continue in Christ. So are all of us who hold that position a 'cult' too??

The other big issue I have is that some 'preachers' who are loud in their condemnation of the CoW are the very ones who preach the strong messages that can so easily be taken to extremes by young zealous people. These 'preachers' should have been looking to reach out and take some responsibility for some of their hard line preaching that may have contributed to this situation, rather than just distancing themselves from them. I wonder if it is just self preservation for fear of being associated with a group that may end up doing something really stupid.


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Dave

 2014/5/1 4:48Profile
KingJimmy
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 Re: The Church of Wells Discerning - The Church of Wells Website

I saw Paul washer put out a statement on twitter a few weeks ago. I thought it was curious. What's their deal?


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Jimmy H

 2014/5/1 10:19Profile
havok20x
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 Re:

Heydave,

I live 20 minutes from the Church of Wells.

Brother Greg would be in the wrong if he were bad-mouthing them and maligning them; however, to point out error is not wrong.

Paul did it in Galatians in regards to Peter--he even told the exact circumstance and who was involved. Would you be telling Paul that he was wrong for pointing out Peter's error to the church in Galatia?

Obviously Brother Greg would like to see them restored to Orthodoxy and all the members of that Church to follow the Lord, our True Shepherd.

Heresy is a real issue and we have grown childish in our understanding of the word of God and how it is to be applied--to the point that we are almost incapable of discerning what is truth and what is heresy. There is a truth and it is right, which means everything that does not conform to the truth is a lie.

 2014/5/1 10:24Profile
Heydave
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 Re:

havok20x,

I think you misunderstand what I am saying. I am not accusing Brother Greg of anything. What I disagree with is the CARM website and I don't think Greg is behind that.

I agree with you that error needs to be pointed out and I in no way endorse the Church of Wells. However as I understand it, it is not a matter of doctrine per se. It is more the fact of how they have interpreted and applied doctrine and a spiritual pride.

My issue is that there is a degree of hypocrisy in ones who have preached very strong messages that appear to have influenced this group, now are quick to condemn them for taking it to an extreme they never intended. There should be some accountability for what we preach and it is easy to over emphasise a point to the degree some may take it too literally.

Here's something from the website that I think is way off beam.
In establishing that they think that the CoW believes in salvation by works they say:
"Anyone who seeks in any way to be made right with God by keeping the law, which includes loving God (Deut. 6:5) and loving your neighbor (Lev. 19:18), is cursed."

So according to the CARM website loving God and loving your neighbour are works of the law. In this regard they are diametrically opposed to the teaching of Christ, who stated that these are the greatest commandments and are expected to be the fruit of true Christians. This is typical of the over emphasised reformed teaching of salvation by faith alone. They cannot see that you cannot separate faith and works produced by faith. That's why Luther did not like the book of James, he didn't understand it.


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Dave

 2014/5/1 11:36Profile
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 Re:

Does anyone have a list or know which specific beliefs held by this group are considered to be heretical? I know nothing about them and it is not clear from the linked website what strange things they believe.


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Todd

 2014/5/1 11:37Profile
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 Re:

Brothers,

I agree that I usually do not endorse or am happy with any type of discernment website that just maligns, slanders and speakings ill of christians who have some questionable practices. To me the Church of Wells is not as much a doctrinal problem as a social and manipulative controlling problem.

They have caused much hurt to people in the Name of Christ and have separated many godly families that I personally know of. To me that they teach you can lose your salvation is a part of the problem. I do believe one can lose their salvation but they teach it in such a harsh, strong way that they have people literally scared and therefore it is easy to control them. They end up making it seem if anyone leaves the church they will lose their salvation and walk away from the truth.

Once they have people in Wells with them they start to control all aspects of their life. People are never allowed to go on their own to make decisions for themselves, they must always be with others in the Church for most things. Alot of the money everyone makes is controlled by the Church, which can be fine for a christian community but they use it to control people for their ends.

It is just 100% clear to me that they have caused MUCH hurt to MANY godly christians that I know and are 100% in the public eye making quite strong mistakes with certain things they are doing. Groups like this will hasten persecution on other groups of true believers that are following the Lord whole-heartily.

Again, this is one of the first times I have made a public stance like this with a statement. Paul Washer's heartcry group helped to assemble the website. They have hurt many godly families in the open air preaching community also therefore brother Paul knows many who have been HURT also by this.

If I am wrong in this brethren please clearly help me to see why. I do have a heart for these young men to repent and change their ways. They have rejected correction from many godly Elders and godly Preachers such as Keith Daniel who they admired GREATLY and he corrected them, so they rejected him.

I did have the 2 main elders travel with me so I could try and help them by just being with them for 2 weeks because back then I already sensed they were over-zealous and needed balance. So I tried to passively help them by bringing them with me to Ireland and Wales. Sadly at the end of the trip they corrected me and in a sense dis-fellowshipped me.


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SI Moderator - Greg

 2014/5/1 11:54Profile
Heydave
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 Re:

Hi Greg,

Thanks for the clarification. I agree with most of what you have written and you know these people, I don't. I suppose I just don't like the tone of that website.

Regarding the CoW,in these types of set ups it is normally one particular individual leader that is the main controlling influence. I have my feelings as to which one that is based on things I have viewed about them and I expect you may also have thoughts on this. It would be good to pray that the Lord breaks the hold this one has and opens the eyes of the others to see what the reality is.


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Dave

 2014/5/1 12:18Profile
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 Re:

Quote:
I have my feelings as to which one that is based on things I have viewed about them and I expect you may also have thoughts on this. It would be good to pray that the Lord breaks the hold this one has and opens the eyes of the others to see what the reality is.



Sean Morris.


Do pray for Him and that the Lord would unveil his heart and eyes to see the wrong way he is on. May God have abundant great mercy.


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SI Moderator - Greg

 2014/5/1 12:29Profile
mattf12486
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 Re:

My 2 friends have been captured and are still bound by the church of wells teaching. My friend Taylor has never responded to any of my texts or emails ever since I rebuked him for his error and pleaded with him to reconsider. My brother has been in contact with Taylor but reasoning from the scriptures with him is virtually impossible. He's "perfected" his faith and is not able to receive from anyone other than the church of wells. Everyone who disagrees with COW is "walking in darkness" and won't "come to the light."

My brother believes that the COW theology is based upon hebrews 10:26 and you are kept in a state of constant fear of your salvation. My brother told me that when he spoke with Taylor that he stated the doctrine of eternal security is heretical and doesn't allow you to properly "fear God." This church has slipped into satanic teaching and only the Lord can set them free.

 2014/5/1 14:03Profile





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