| Re: |
Excellent point MrBill. Good post.
I would assume that the facilities were built for the purpose of a group of believers gathering to worship our Creator and Savior.
I have heard that in some these videos of this dance the people end up removing some of their clothing and doing sexually suggestive moves and such.
This does not belong in the Church or in the buildings built for worshipping Him.
What ever happen to Holy reverence for God?
| 2013/3/12 13:44||Profile|
| Re: Harlem Shake ... lewd suggestive dancing ... becoming popular amongst "Chris|
I feel I must wager in here and strongly object to some of the tone on this thread.
To make things clear, I think this whole Harlem shake thing is a silly internet craze, and I find it as ridiculous as I did that stupid 'gangham style' meme a couple of months back. I for one think it is an odd thing to be recreating and I expect most of those doing so are unaware of the dance's origins. I personally have managed to boycott watching a single harlem shake video, and don't intend to see any.
I recently became aware that the youth group at my church did a version of the video. As far as I'm aware this was not done as a gimmick to get more to attend, but just as a bit of fun (and yes, odd fun I admit). It certainly did not take the place of the usual worship and bible study that take place at the youth group meetings. I used to help and volunteer with the group as a leader until this year, when I am now too busy with my work to continue to commit (alas).
It's a mixed bunch but I can certainly say that many of them sincerely love Jesus and are trying to live for him. The youth minister is a personal friend of mine and one of the most humble, loving and godly people I know at that church.
Now, I could understand if anyone were to say that any of these young people (or leader) are unwise or ignorant for choosing to do the video. However, to say that they are false Christians, or do not have the spirit of Christ, or are "Christians" (or another of the countless other judgemental insults that get thrown around this forum) is way out of order.
What on earth gives any of you the authority to pass eternal condemnation on such folks?
I posed this question on previous thread (at that time I was unaware that my church youth group were doing a version of the video).
| 2013/3/12 14:10|
| Re: |
thank u butters. glad sum1 said this very strongly. i was trying 2 be nice and diplomatic, but i think u said exactly what needs 2 be said. the judgementalism on this forum can be very thick sumtimes, and u sliced right through it. well done.
| 2013/3/12 14:37||Profile|
| Re: |
I think prayer is still the answer for these young ones. When those in the church behave like the world there is cause for alarm. Of course I will probably be called judgmental but I am honestly beginning to think that is a complement. I imagine that Paul, Peter, and John would have been called judgmental also because they called for those claiming to follow JESUS to "live" as HE did, holy and righteous lives.
I think its sad that so many are deceived into thinking that we can still hang out with the world and behave like the world and at the same time walk with JESUS.
For those who see this as "no big deal" I ask sincerely if your son or daughter was in one of these videos, moving and making the motions with their bodies as some are in these videos would you be fine with it? Would it cause you to pause for a moment if you saw your son or daughter dancing so inappropriately?
| 2013/3/12 14:57||Profile|
| Re: |
I have never seen the Harlem shake, but I have had it explained to me. I don't think that the craze is problematic, but rather symptomatic.
I recall a church camp at which I volunteered to cook breakfast and do all of the handyman projects around the grounds and buildings. The director of the camp had structured the camp's theme around "The Hunger Games". It was a bit of a play on words as the hunger he was trying to get across was a hunger for the Lord. The problem was that the youth were intimately familiar with the movie. (I have never seen this one either, but I have heard of its themes and content.)
These things are symptoms of a church that is firmly plugged into the spirit of this age. This intimacy with the world, its entertainments, and its philosophies is the problem. The craze over the Harlem shake is only the natural and logical symptom or outworking of this problem.
It is not that we as believers should be unaware of what is happening in our society. We are not to be monastic and hide ourselves away. But we are to be careful that we are not active participants in the ways of this age and that we are not adopting as our own the philosophies of this age. We are to be in the world, but not of the world.
I think we as the church at large are too often unaware of the impact that this world is having upon us. We don't realize that there is a huge battle of philosophies being waged. Paul tells us that we need to be sure that we are not robbed of what is really of value by philosophies and vain deceits.
Being plugged into the life of God, into the Word, and into God's way of thinking will produce in us the evidence of intimacy with God, which will be peace, love, joy, holiness, the power of God, grace, etc. It will naturally cause us to bear the fruit of the Spirit as we have our roots in the Spirit. Being plugged into the world will produce in us the works of the flesh and the trappings of dead religious exercise, self-righteousness, worry, doubt, licentiousness, compromise, fleshliness, etc. The two philosophies are diametrically opposed to one another.
It is difficult, sometimes, to bring someone to realize how important this is. Deception has, bound up in its very definition, the fact that the deceived does not know he is deceived. I know many who, if I said, "You had not ought to be doing that.", would revolt against me and proclaim me to be self-righteous, judgmental, and unloving. In fact, they would proclaim me to be very un-Christ-like. I have found it best to simply proclaim clearly the truth of the word of God, and allow the Holy Spirit to use that word to divide between soul and spirit in their own lives. For a few that I know of, the light has begun to dawn and God is leading them into some significant changes in their habits.
| 2013/3/12 15:45||Profile|
| Re: |
there is a "the sky is falling" mentality here. the harlem shake is a fad just like gangum style was. gangum style is out of date already and its not even a year old yet. there will be sumthing else to draw the ire of all those who find demons behind every shrub. not saying the concerns are not legitimate, just saying it is becoming increasingly difficult to stomache the judgementalism among sum of u. a while ago after i signed up 4 this forum i cruised some of the older threads still available here. i read sum where people here were questioning the salvation of christians who celebrate christmas. i am thankful that father god is my judge.
| 2013/3/12 16:14||Profile|
| Re: |
Haven't posted in a while - but been lurking a bit. Had to reply to this as part of my job requires some understanding of internet 'culture' and trends/fads, especially viral and social media and knew of this long before it became 'big'. (Hope I don't sound too hipster there!)
Irrespective of what you may think of my post, I hope that some find it helpful to know something of it's background - the Harlem Shake is historically a drunken dance - quote from the Wiki entry on it: Al B (originator of the dance move) is quoted saying that the dance is "a drunken shake anyway, it's an alcoholic shake, but it's fantastic, everybody appreciates it."
To perform drunken dancing in a church setting seems a little disrespectful to a Holy God.
Then the lyrics, which roughly translated:
With the terrorists
Hey, Hey, Hey, Hey
Shake, Ta. Ta
And do the Harlem Shake
Shake Hey, Hey
Shake, Shake, Shake
With the terrorists
Hey, with terrorists
Again, probably not something to sing in a church context. And what's with all the terrorist stuff?
Finally, consider that the artist is getting royalties from the lyrical samples he has stolen, if you understand the music industry in any way, uncleared samples are a no-no and a lawsuit waiting to happen.
Sure, it's a silly dance, rapidly becoming annoying - but think on this: If people attend a church just because they're doing a fad dance craze, what happens after? I won't personally watch the C3 church video because I consider it utter blasphemy to Jesus Christ.
As much as this is just a stupid craze (which a number of us would wish goes away quickly) the depths to which a church uses the world... I'm lost for words here.
| 2013/3/12 16:33||Profile|
| Re: |
If people attend a church just because they're doing a fad dance craze, what happens after?
good post, brother. thank u.
i maintain that NO ONE who is unsaved attends church because the church is doing a fad dance craze. in fact, i think the world looks on and thinks the church is stupid when it does things like that. i would agree. i just stop short of condemning people to hell as has been done here.
| 2013/3/12 17:08||Profile|
| Re: |
After reconsidering my last post I feel that the person I was addressing might misunderstand my meaning and I did not want to cause any ill will so I have decided to remove it. I do not want to cause any strife and feel that I have shard all the LORD has for me to on this topic so I will just say I think praying for those who are lost in the world is the best way to respond at this time.
| 2013/3/12 18:03||Profile|
Monroe, LA - USA
| Re: "condemning"|
by SkepticGuy on 2013/3/12 14:08:00
i just stop short of condemning people to hell as has been done here.
WHO has condemned anyone to hell in this thread???
When someone makes a statement like this:
"Somehow these poor deceived souls need to be informed that the wrath of God is going to fall upon their "Christian" souls and they will burn in hell forever unless they truly repent of such evil deeds by trusting in the finished work of Christ."
you are falsely accusing the person to say that he is "condemning people to hell"
Definition of Condemn: "2.Sentence (someone) to a particular punishment, esp. death: "the rebels had been condemned to death"."
When someone simply repeats what God has already declared in the Bible like:
"except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish."
"Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God."
"Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God."
That person is simply SOUNDING THE WARNING of what such people will be faced with on the REAL day when God WILL pass the eternal sentence on such people and send them to eternal hell.
God has already declared what He will do on the day of judgment. If I sound His warning (as I should if I am faithful to Him), I am not declaring the final condemnation (it is not over yet ... that person just might repent), I am warning of what THE JUDGE has already declared that He will do!
| 2013/3/12 19:55||Profile|