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Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : Mormonism, Goose Bumps and the Great Falling Away by Jennifer LeClaire

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ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779


 Re:

Hi Miccah,

Quote:

Chris, does Jesus want us to be yolked with cults? We both know the answer to this. So how is this a personal view? The Lord tells us to be seperate, to not have any look of evil, to warn the flock about damnable heresys.



I am not "yoked" together with a cult. When I go to Safeway to purchase a gallon of milk, I am not endorsing the religious views of whoever manages or owns the grocery chain.

Remember: Some unsaved people go to Chick-fil-A because they like the chicken sandwiches and sweet tea and not because of the views of the CEO.

I think that Mitt Romney is a better choice than Barack Obama -- not because of his Mormonism -- but because I think that his decisions on many issues is better.

Quote:

Nothing of a personal view about it. My personal view is to vote Obama out of office and to get someone in there that will stop abortion. My political science degree tells me to get everyone to vote and choose a candidate based on the betterment of the nation.

But this election is different. Christians, CHRISTIANS are supporting a Mormon for President, one who WILL lead others down the path of his religion. Christians are doing this with no shame!



Likewise, my decision to vote is a personal view based upon my education, research and understanding. However, that stands behind the fact that I will PRAY and prayerfully STUDY God's Word before I vote.

Let me be clear: Romney will not lead me "down the path of his religion." If anything, most scientific polls indicate that his religious beliefs are quite unpopular with his supporters and non-supporters alike. In other words, those who might be inclined to think that he is a better choice will do so despite his religious views and not because of them.

Quote:

Chris. These above two quotes is the issue in the Church today. Knowingly voting for a cult member who's religion leads to Hell.

It is like we have all fallen into crazyville or something.



I disagree. It isn't about endorsing the man's religious views. In 2008, when a slight majority of Americans -- including a few here on SermonIndex -- voted for Barack Obama, polls indicated they did so despite his affiliation with Reverend Jeremiah Wright or the Liberation Theology cult.

Now, the choice in 2012 is between Barack Obama (a pro-abortion, pro-homosexual marriage Liberation Theology cult) and Mitt Romney (an anti-abortion, anti-homosexual activism Mormon)...or simply deciding to not vote and let everyone else choose.

When I was in college, a ranking member of Bill Clinton's election team spoke in one of my classes. He mentioned how it was NOT the goal or the Clinton election team in 1992 and 1996 to simply get Christians to vote for Bill Clinton. They knew that it just wouldn't happen in large numbers. Rather, he simply wanted to keep Christians from making a decision at all.

They knew that Clinton would probably not win a majority of vote (he won with 43% in '92 and 49% in '96); so, their strategy was to point out the "deficiencies" in the other guy's religious beliefs. By prodding Christians to stay home, it would prevent the Christians from making an impact in those elections.

It worked. Clinton won the election by "plurality" rather than "majority."

In this election, I don't care about Mitt Romney's Mormonism. It is a cult, but it is NOT the reason that many Americans will vote for him. And, of course, believers know how to divide spirit from flesh, soul and spirit with the Word of God. If Mitt Romney tried to "push" his Mormon views, polls indicate that they would be strongly rejected by believers and unbelievers alike.


_________________
Christopher

 2012/9/24 16:28Profile









 Re:

Miccah write..........

"It is like we have all fallen into crazyville or something."

Its called blindness Miccah, a great deception. Now we must expect those who are blind and deceived when presented with the truth to either

1. See the truth
2. Continue to be blind ( oftentimes willful ignorance)
3. Apathy
4. Anger
5. Hatred
6. Attack those who stand upon the truth.

Now, if anyone knows anything of church history, they will know this is the pattern that has always existed. When a brother or sister would stand up and challenge the Catholic church for instance, they were labelled by the church as arrogant, and boastful and ultimately a heretic. The personal animosity towards these brothers and sisters knew no bounds. Rather than accept that these people disagreed with their position or doctrine, they always took it as a personal attack on them and this fueled great hatred.

It is always good to look at a man's words. See what is the abundance of his heart, for out of that abundance he will speak. There is coming a time soon when you will not be legally allowed to say what I and others have said about Mormonism on this thread, it will be considered arrogant and hate speech. Bills have already been attempted in Britain and in Canada to stop the sharing of the Gospel in work-places because of our stance that Christianity is the only way to heaven and all others paths lead to hell. Here is my last word on this thread and may the Lord bless all who will boldly stand upon the truth...........bro Frank

Out of the abundance of the heart
The mouth speaks
Out of the mouth of an angry man
The mouth shrieks

The world follows its own
And in derision it will laugh
God's people follow the Lord
As He leads them down the narrow path

The wisdom of the world
Is mere foolishness to God
And those who walk the broad path
Must choose to ignore His Word

God's word will be heard
Along the narrow way
And there's many a pied piper
To lead the world astray

If you listen to the siren's call
You'll end up on the rocks
If you listen to the world at large
You'll hear just how she mocks

Look and see who stands up proud
And like a flag becomes unfurled
When all they believe is challenged
The ways and the means of the world

God's ways are not the ways of men
We belong outside the gate
He makes us walk the narrow path
And the crooked paths made straight

So many men are entangled
And adrift in the stormy sea
Its better the smite of a friend
Than the kiss of the enemy

Come now and walk the narrow path
And leave the world to its own
Seek Him with your whole heart
And gather before His throne





 2012/9/24 16:28
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779


 Re:

Frank,

Quote:

1. See the truth
2. Continue to be blind ( oftentimes willful ignorance)
3. Apathy
4. Anger
5. Hatred
6. Attack those who stand upon the truth.



You aren't being "hated" or "attacked." I am simply asking you to stop attacking those that you disagree with and labeling us as "blind" or "prone to vote for the Anti-Christ" simply because we don't accept your views and opinions.

There is a difference between taking a stand for "truth" and taking a stand for "Frank's opinion." And, of course, attacking others because they disagree with your opinion is not "standing upon the truth."


_________________
Christopher

 2012/9/24 16:31Profile
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Chris,

You keep speaking about the marketplace, the Lord addresses the marketplace.

Please show me, in scripture (in context), where believers are to establish and endorse a Satanic leader to lead over them, secular or spiritually...


_________________
Christiaan

 2012/9/24 16:47Profile
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779


 Re:

Miccah,

Quote:

You keep speaking about the marketplace, the Lord addresses the marketplace.

Please show me, in scripture (in context), where believers are to establish and endorse a Satanic leader to lead over them, secular or spiritually...



The "marketplace" choices are merely an example, type or anecdote of what you are presenting as so important on a national level. When I choose my job, I pray about it. I may never even know before I choose the job whether or not the manager or CEO is a Christian. However, I will pray about it...and determine (with God's guidance) the best job that will help me provide for my family and the work of Christ.

It is odd, but many people quote passages about "obedience" and "submission to governments" when speaking of President Obama. Yet, this nation has no king. This is a nation "of the people" and those who serve in office are merely private citizens selected by fellow citizens in a vote.

Now, I think that there is a difference between a person in spiritual error and belongs to a damnable cult that they believe to be "Christian" and someone who is willful participant in Satanism. Yes, both are paths to Hell. However, one is a path chosen through error and the other is willful.

Yet, in this case, it isn't about Romney's Mormonism. The church that he attends will not be on the ballot. However, his policy beliefs are implied because they are what he says he will do. Obama says that he will support abortion, homosexual marriage and other things like this. Romney will not. People who are deciding upon Romney aren't doing so because of the church that he attends but because of the policies that he claims to support.


_________________
Christopher

 2012/9/24 17:00Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3422
Texas

 Re:

Well there is no good choice, and for someone with True Christian beliefs, if you endorse either you are still going against everything "most" true Christians believe and stand against. The amount of difference in the two, is not enought to make a difference, we are splitting hairs now trying to justify either. One will win, and neither is going to be the silver bullet to fix the mess were all in, only God can help us.


_________________
Bill

 2012/9/24 17:30Profile









 Re:

Chris I ask again. Do you think Romney is going to leave the teachings of Joseph Smith at the front door of the White House?

Bearmaster.

 2012/9/24 17:31
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779


 Re:

Quote:

Chris I ask again. Do you think Romney is going to leave the teachings of Joseph Smith at the front door of the White House?

Bearmaster.



And, again, I respond that we are not choosing the man's religious beliefs. Most polls indicate that those who might feel that Romney will do so DESPITE his religious beliefs.

But, this is not the topic. Mormonism is not the issue to me because we recognize it as a cult.

The issue that I have is with those who will subtly reject the faith of those of us who might feel inclined to think that Romney is the better choice for various reasons. We are told that we are "blind" or prone to "vote for the Anti-Christ." Our relationship with Christ is rejected. When we simply ask those who do attack us to stop, they pretend that they are being attacked for "standing upon the truth."


_________________
Christopher

 2012/9/24 17:36Profile
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

chris,

Please show me, in scripture (in context), where believers are to establish and endorse a Satanic leader to lead over them, secular or spiritually...



_________________
Christiaan

 2012/9/24 17:42Profile
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779


 Re:

Miccah,

I believe that I already explained this to you. You might want to go back over my previous posts so that I don't have to write my response all over again.

Likewise, perhaps you can show me in Scripture (in context) where certain believers can use a public forum to attack other believers who hold a different opinion about this matter, insinuate that they are "blind" and prone to "voting for the Anti-Christ" (and worse) and then pretend that they are the victim when they are asked to not do this.


_________________
Christopher

 2012/9/24 17:45Profile





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