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 Re:

Staff,
I have attempted to answer your questions multiple times on multiple threads. What leads us to believe persecution is soon coming is:.........the Spirit of the Lord. The Spirit of Prophecy is the Spirit of Jesus. The Lord has placed it on the hearts/minds of his people by the Holy Spirit. The Lord began to speak of this to me, & many others 10-15+ years ago, but 2-3 years ago a sense of urgency came to the Body far and wide, including to men like David Wilkerson, Art Katz, Paul Washer, Carter Conlon, Andrew Strom, etc., etc., etc., as well as many other "unknown" brethren throughout hidden away in the wilderness of the unknown on earth. How do we know? By the Spirit. You keep asking the same question & I keep giving you the same answer.

Another question kinda on another topic, but related, have you sought the Lord to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit? The Promise for all who believe, ask, seek, & knock under the new covenant? God is faithful if we ask Him in faith. "What father of His son asks for bread will give him a stone?.....the Father knows how to give good gifts & will give the Holy Spirit to him who asks..."

 2012/7/1 11:29









 Re:

Also, a new fresh sense of urgency has come to the Body in just the last few weeks/months again, so the Lord is warning His Bride to prepare for what's coming. His delay is an act of His mercy as always before judgment.

 2012/7/1 11:31









 Re: Staff

Brother I am not going to hijack this thread by turning it into a theological debate. If you want to have a discussion of the various tribulational views then open up another thread. I will gladly interact with you on that thread.

But to your other question. What is the basis if my believing persecution is coming to Americs. Two things. The New Testament and watching trends in the world. Suffice to say that Jesus and his apostles taught persecution would come as a result of following him. The early church experienced it. And for two thousand years the believing church of Jesus Christ has testified to it. I could quote verse after verse in the New Testament that speak of persecutions that come as a result of following Christ. But you do the digging. Take a concordance. One is to expect persecution when they follow Jesus. The verses of the New Testament speak of this. Jesus said that if they persecuted me they will persecute you. Paul write those that those who live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted. This is true of any follower of Jesus. Even believers in the west.

Second observing world trends. In reading profiles that reflect the persecuted church. Observers report an increase in persecution across the restricted nations. Particularly because if the Islamic hijacking if the Arab spring. Persecution of believers is on the increase in Mauritania, Lybia, Syria, Iraq, etc. Nations such as China, Iran, Cuba have launched new crack downs against believers in those nations. Egypt and Turkey are coming against believers. Sudan is committing ethnic cleansing against the Christian Nubians. Islamic extremist are killing Christians in Nigeria.

If we believe persecution is of Satan then the enemy will launch persecution against believers in the west. Particularly in America. With Moslems coming into N. America there are already moves afoot to implement Sharia. Moslens have said their desire is to see the U S turned into a caliphate ruled by sharia. You know how the Moslems feel about Christians. Next to their hatred of Israel Moslems despise Christians.

Another dynamic is s hatred of Christ and what he stands for in America. This hostility to the things of Jesus was started by the secular humanist decades ago. It has given rise to the removing of prayer and nativity scenes in he public sector to the advancing of gay rights. One may teach homosexuality to a child in the public school. This has the approval of society. But dare one teach the person and work of Jesus they are excoriated.

When you read of a couple being fined for having a Bibke study in their home in California. Or a school teacher being fired from his job in Colorado for reading his Bible on his own time. Or a pastor who resigns from his police chaplaincy in N. Carolina because he cannot pray in the name of Jesus. You know persecution has come to America. And it will only get worse.

Respectfully Bearmaster.

 2012/7/1 12:33









 Re:

Hi Guys, as you can probably tell from the OP, this was not an apologetic piece. I am not arguing or debating certain positions, I have zero desire to do that. This is why I told Staff that we would agree to disagree. This piece, in my opinion, is for those who have ears to hear. I deliberately did not go into details of all the different positions there are on eschatology. I do not nor have ever believed that other positions are heresy or anything like that. None of us hold to a perfect doctrine. And so my piece stands as to how I am led. Now of course others can and do say that they too are led in a different position, and this is where I am very happy to leave it in the hands of God as we will all give answer to Him for how we lived our lives.

And so I would simply reiterate, its time to get ready, its time to count the cost and its time to pray and draw near to our Lord. One could argue, and I would agree, that this would and should be normal Christianity. Unfortunately we live in times where this is not normal. And if the Lord in His mercy has called on some brothers and sisters to wake the sleeping church up, then those people must do what they have been called to do. There will always be the naysayers who say " you have not been called," or that " you cannot prove these things," but as I said, all of us answer to God for the things that we speak or the things that we write or convey on " His behalf." ...............bro Frank

Self is the opaque veil that hides the face of God from us.It can be removed only in spiritual experience, never by mere instruction. We may as well try to instruct leprosy out of our system. There must be a work of God in destruction before we are free. We must invite the cross to do its deadly work within us. We must bring our self-sins to the cross for judgment. We must prepare ourselves for an ordeal of suffering in some measure like that through which our Savior passed when He suffered under Pontius Pilate.
... A. W. Tozer (1897-1963), The Pursuit of God [1948],
Christian Publications, 1982, p. 43

 2012/7/1 13:58









 Re: Recommebded reading.

Aside from the New Testament that should always be at the top of every list. I recommend Tortured for Christ by Richard Wirmbrandt. And Cost of Discipleship by Dietrich Bonhoffer. Both of these books address the subject of persecution and suffering. Both if these books were written by men who suffered.

Bearmaster.

 2012/7/1 15:12
pilgrim777
Member



Joined: 2011/9/30
Posts: 1211


 Re:

Quote:
Apollus: And so I would simply reiterate, its time to get ready, its time to count the cost and its time to pray and draw near to our Lord.



Amen, brother - the Spirit is speaking to many brothers and sisters, far and wide.

Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.

Pilgrim

 2012/7/1 15:43Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1418


 Re:

Hi Jeffmar,
I will respond separately to your [points.
Your Qoute:
Also, a new fresh sense of urgency has come to the Body in just the last few weeks/months again, so the Lord is warning His Bride to prepare for what's coming. His delay is an act of His mercy as always before judgment.

What specific prophesy's have been made regarding this persecution?and do you believe this persecution is a judgement?
Thanks Staff

 2012/7/1 17:34Profile
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1418


 Re:

Hi Jeffemar,
This is the first time on any thread that someone has admitted to me that it is the Holy Spirit that is bringing this message."Placed on hearts/minds" isnt a prophesy as far as I can see. I do not consider 10-15yrs or 2-3 yrs as soon.What is soon to you?
Art Katz was a great preacher but he is dead since 2007.
Carter Conlon has preached on this subject recently as far as i know.
What specifically did god say to you about the persecution?

The baptism of the Holy Spirit is not really anything to do with this.
At least you have nailed your colours to the mast and said that God told you which he may have.
Yours Staff

 2012/7/1 17:45Profile









 Re:

Let me ask, what would the North American church be persecuted for?

Specifically?

Marc mc

 2012/7/1 18:19









 Re:

Just listened to Denny Kenniston on The Upcoming Wave of Persecution. He makes reference to persecution coming to America. Good stuff and compliment to this thread.

Bearmaster.

 2012/7/1 18:21





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