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 Re:

A careful study of Romans Chpts 9 through 11 will prove out that Paul is discussing his kinsmen, the Jews.


Rom 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew.

 2012/5/31 14:48
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: ArtB

I asked "Does the Bible associate psychological issues with medical or with spiritual??"

RE: ArtB wrote "Tourettes Syndrome is clearly a medical caused disease. In medeival times such a person would probably burned alive for being demon possessed."

You avoided the question I asked what the Bible says?? I care less what Modern medicine believes!!

RE: ArtB wrote
"I would not just say that Luther became bitter, hateful, and violent. I would add that Luther's mind became disoriented due to an extreme case of tinnitis, which could not be treated in the 16th Century, and his thinking became irrational and paranoid."

You have revealed more about Luther than I had any Idea of.

Just because a man looses his mind does not excuse anything people loose there minds all the time what is left is what they are, They no longer have the clothes to hide it. Many are more loving and caring than they where before, others suprise us. once the mind is gone all that is left is the inner man would you disagree??

 2012/5/31 14:56Profile









 Re:


I'm not trying to be hard on Luther by what I've posted, nor hard on people with afflictions - GOD forbid, I could write a book on my own physical infirmities and the Christians that I know from support groups for those with physical diseases of many kinds. Besides, my heart has always been for caring for the sick since I was a child - so I pray that you'd see Art, that I'm not coming from a heartless position.

Luther, held on to some things like Mariology and other beliefs that wouldn't have helped him "spiritually" but I am glad that he pronounced salvation by grace through faith.
Having lived with and around Catholics all of my life, there was a time that the Psychiatric journals did record the largest number of those that were institutionalized were Catholics. That's changed over the decades as Catholics became less "religious".

I just felt to alleviate any potential fears that could come from a person believing that "noise" alone [tinnitis] will cause mental and doctrinal insanity. The Holy Spirit of Truth is much more capable than we give Him credit for. If we listen to the world's systems of so-called science or understandings - we do not get innerant truth, but mere GOD-less theories.


Very much appreciate & respect your contributions and person, Brother.

 2012/5/31 15:11









 Re:

Since Luther is being discussed and his medical conditions. I say conditions because be also had severe bowel issues plus digestive issues. But what of spiritual issues. One account says Luther saw a vision of the devil and be got angry and threw an ink well at him. I guess that woukd be appropiate for someone not trained in spiritual warfare.

But realize you are speaking of a man God did use to bring the church back to salvation by faith. So one wonders if Luther was afflicted by deminics.

But then think if Smith Wiggkesworth. Ab account says he was sleeping quite soundly. Satan came into his room. Smith sensed his presence. Woke io. Saw the evil one. Said " Oh its you". Turned went back to sleep. Truly a man secure in Christ.

Bearmaster.

 2012/5/31 15:18









 Re:

You made me laugh, Bearman. Now I know what's wrong with me. I was bottle fed Wigglesworth my first month of salvation. lol! I loved it! Faith to move mountains.
Well, anyways - I do have very bad tinnitis since '94 but I also have documentation from several Drs that I haven't gone nuts - yet. :)
BTW, I never did go to a Christian Psychologist when I left my Pastor's counseling. The revelation of his future heart attack was enough to keep my mind occupied on Pastor's problems over mine and 'that' is a sure way to stay sane as well - despite being physically sick & living in a cruel prison at the time - it is true that if we think of others, we ourselves are cared for by our Master, The Chief Protectorate and Physician.

Hey, we with tinnitis have a joke - we ask others - "My ears are making so much noise - is it bothering you?" or "... can you hear it?"

A Merry heart maketh good like a medicine. PTL!

LORD Bless you too!

 2012/5/31 15:33
ArtB
Member



Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 431
New York

 Re:

Dear Jesus-is-God,

I always respect your views.

My views on Luther's Meniere's Disease was from several medical reports that I read on the on the internet, but not from Wikipedia. They proclaimed Luther as an extreme example. How valid these comments were is beyond my ability to assess them.

I have, on occasion, had short bouts of internal ringing in my ears that lasted a very short time. It felt like my ear was looking for that sound and provided it. It did not come from anywhere else. I ignored it and it went away.

Based on what I had read about Luther from His thoughtful caring early writings to his insane horrific later writings, that the extreme extent of his sickness may explain his descent into madness.

Personally, I am not qualified to give any medical opinions. I thank you for your input related thereto.

I do believe that Luther opened the door for many Catholics to leave Catholicism in order to get back to the Bible as per his own example.


_________________
Arthur Biele

 2012/5/31 18:30Profile









 Re:

Hi Brother Art. Oh, no doubt that Luther did well. The video that was a dramatization of his life certainly convinced me of that.

My main concern was for the growing numbers of people that are developing tinnitis and Meniere's and that because of the tremendous increase of neurotoxins in our environment - that they don't get the wrong impression that they are doomed to insanity.
These diseases have the 'potential' to drive one to desperation - especially when all the Drs recommend are drugs that have worse side affects than the diseases themselves. I can understand taking a drug to counter-act nausea, if that drug was developed solely for nausea - but as you know, more times than not, the medical establishment hands out anti-depressants like candy and I do not by any means recommend those.
I couldn't sympathize more with anyone with these illnesses and they are much more than mere 'ringing in the ears' - as you experienced and as you've more than likely have read - as I read in one of your posts. It can wake you up with pain in the ear{s} as well, when it's really loud and there's multiple frequencies - as I saw that you had posted as well.

GOD's Grace is sufficient, as He told Paul. I feel more pain for those poor folks with arthritis. People that live all day, every day in severe pain. GOD help them!
As one of our sisters here had posted, there are also people that are electronically sensitive and tinnitis also has been proven to be a neurological disease. I got my blessing from acquiring three strains of Lyme. But The LORD has been so close to me, it's hard to explain - but I believe you know - the grace that He pours out and our stretching to reach Him when ill. I do remember your post and feel that comradary of a fellow inflicted Christian that I feel when I'm with the others that are. Thorns in the flesh are going to be worth it when we see Him. GOD only knows what we'd have become or not become without them - dependent on our own brains or choices of actions would have been pitiful; in hind-sight.

His Great Love & Grace to you, Brother. Pray one for another.

 2012/5/31 23:03
proudpapa
Member



Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re: ArtB

RE: ArtB wrote
"Based on what I had read about Luther from His thoughtful caring early writings to his insane horrific later writings"

I have to say, I did not no much about the Reformers up untill the last couple of years and since that time it seems every time That I study about them something more disturbing is revealed, But I have noticed early on with the reformers they wrote a lot of good things and undoubtly there is a certain respect that they deserve.
We will never understand the spirtual forces that must have done everything it could to destroy them.

 2012/5/31 23:23Profile
ArtB
Member



Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 431
New York

 Re:

"Jesus-is-GOD on 2012/5/31 20:03:1 wrote:

"Hi Brother Art. Oh, no doubt that Luther did well. The video that was a dramatization of his life certainly convinced me of that.

My main concern was for the growing numbers of people that are developing tinnitis and Meniere's and that because of the tremendous increase of neurotoxins in our environment - that they don't get the wrong impression ... ."

Yes, I've caught on to this in your last post. I did not mean to cause a panic. My reading also led me to believe that it is quite treatable today. I am trying to backtrack based on what you shared. I do appreciate your very thoughtful posts on this matter.


_________________
Arthur Biele

 2012/5/31 23:27Profile
ArtB
Member



Joined: 2004/4/27
Posts: 431
New York

 Re:

Thanks for your post, proudpapa. Yes the early reformers got the ball rolling to a back to the Bible and the true gospel of Jesus Christ.

However, I really like the works of today's apologists such as Packer, Tozer, Norman Geisler, Walter Kaiser, and others.


_________________
Arthur Biele

 2012/5/31 23:42Profile





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