Blaine said: "For surely they are not bound by the shackles of religion."

Brother - do you believe a sister that is quiet at home, caring for her family, and submits to her believing husband is bound by the "shackles of religion?"

In Christ -Jim

The Holy Spirit is a dynamic that cannot be controlled by the religious institutions or theology of men. Jesus made this known to a religious teacher in his day. He told Nicodemus concerning the Spirit likening him to the wind. You hear its sound. But you cannot tell where it is coming from or where it is going.

So we see around the world God is raising up new venues we call the church. A number of these churches are led by women who are annoited and filled with Christ. The6 preach, teach, do signs and wonders and bring souls into the kingdom. They are following the Spirit.

What we call church government was not to be written in stone. Letters were written to various churches that had different problems. The apostles and others who wrote those letters were addressing correctives to particular issues. These correctives were not meant to be binding on all churches for all times.

What we perceive in our western mind set as the church will not apply in Africa or Asia. Jesus gave the simplest definition of a church. He defined it as where two or three came togetherin his name he was present. Very simple. The only church government is his presence. Church government set up by man kills the Holy Spirit. I say it again. Church government kills the Holy Spirit.

In a venue where the Holy Spirit is leading and men and women are listening to him. Any can lead. Men or women if they are annoited by the Spirit and called by God. For thisi s what is happening in many third world fellowships.

We will not see this happen in America because our concern is for theology. We are religious. The one thing we are so expert at is killing the Holy Spirit. We have the fire hoses of theology ready to put the Spirit's fire out at a moments notice.

When everything is said and done. Our churches will be the most doctrinally pure but the deadest in the world.

Blaine Scogin

Blaine, is it your belief that the bible is the theology of men?
Sometimes when people get in discussions, they assume they are on the same page, and are just discussing an issue. But I have sometimes stumbled on an awareness.....we maybe we are working from different underlying absolutes.

"I haven't found anyone who will explain this verse yet!"

Then you havent been paying attention sister. It seems that Paul worte there is no male or female in Christ, and since we dont care about context here, that cancels out everything else he ever wrote.

I think Paul must have repented of his sexist attitude after he wrote that to timothy and realized he was binding women with religion and silencing sisters who God had filled with the Holy Spirit. Paul must have been awakened to truth by the same wise council that is being presented on SI, and thankfully he came around to seeing his error in his writing to timothy. Thats when he wrote there is no male or female to show he repented of all the previous things he had written about the roles of brothers and sisters.

That explains it!
Thanks....

"Church government kills the Holy Spirit. I say it again. Church government kills the Holy Spirit."

What about eldership in the church that meets house to house and among the poor in the inner city? That is appointed by God for theie to be elders among the sheep not ruling over them, pastors to build up the body, not rule over it. That is Godly, and it is appointed ot brothers to be pastors, not sisters.

"We will not see this happen in America because our concern is for theology."

This is a straw man and false dichotomy brother. I have seen this happen in America, in a dirty little city in America. The word of God and the spirit of God are not at war with each other dear brother. There are always times when God will do something outside of what we think or percieve to be His word of course though... I will give you that. But, never will He contradict it.

In Christ -Jim

One more thing, I have seen the fire of God fall and taken part in a small local revival and one of the thing that killed it was a lack of doctrine. Someone came in and started teaching law/sabbath keeping and the brothers that should have spoken up and put the man out of fellowship didnt. That grieved the Holy Spirit mightilly. Where was the sound teaching of Christ being our sabbath rest, of every man being pursuaded fully in his own mind on days?

I guess its all just good in the holy spirit though - whatever we want to say the holy spirit is teaching us is fine even if it contradicts the clear writings of the apostles?

God forbid.

Sister I could give you my understanding of 1 Tim.2:11-12. But if I did so there would be so much howling in the forum. So why bother in a hostile environment.

If you really want me to share my thoughts then please email me and I will gladly share my thoughts on these verses. My email address should be in my profile. To bad the PM function was dropped from SI.

Blaine

I am going to say this because I am anonymous here.
There is a sense here that if you believe in the directives that are in scripture, you are squelching the spirit and are so concerned with doctrine that you have no compassion, and no concern for people.
I have spent most of my adult life caring for handicapped people. I remember one patient that was particularly endearing, she had aids, and sadly had sores from shingles. She was so wasted that I could pick her up. She always smiled then, I am not very big, and she found it funny....and also she just needed someone to hold her. My job was to wash her and dress her and love her. She is one of my best memories. Why? Because I knew that it was the holy Spirit who washed her, dressed her, and loved her. And it was His word that had compelled me to be there with Him to do it.
The problem with the American church is not believing God's word. The Holy Spirit who inspired it will give us the grace to embrace it.

Martyr....I will email you....may be latter in the week...will be off of here...got lots to attend to.....have enjoyed the discussion.

I, in my flesh, am a bit of a scoundrel. He is good, He is able.

brother no. A sister who is fulfilling her rile as wife and mother is not bound by the shackles of religion.

Blaine