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 Re:

I agree with you Sarahsdream. Your brother-in-law has opened a door to demonic attack by habitual use of these drugs. There are many brothers in Christ who have had to battle through to deliverance from demonic attacks because of illicit drug use. And schizophrenia is the medical term for people who are suffering from demonic problems in their mind. It's not the occasional sin that leads to demonic problems, but its the habitual sin that usually leads to demonic problems. It is one way the Lord uses to get our attention. The Lord even uses the enemy to accomplish His good purposes in our lives. So:

1. He must be willing to give them up.
2. Find a good deliverance ministry to cast out these spirits. No two deliverance ministries are the same, and some are definitely better than others. But going through deliverance will be futile if the door which allowed these spirits entrance in the first place isn't closed. I could recommend a lot of books.

God bless,
EZ

 2011/7/25 0:38
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3530
Louisiana

 Re:

The source of the problem has to be dealt with in order to obtain deliverance.

Sin has to be confessed and cleansed by the blood of Jesus.

The flesh must be crucified by appropriating Romans 6:6.

Demons must be cast out in the name of Jesus.

As EZ said in his post. Habitual sin, yielding to the flesh in any area repeatedly, opens the door to demons and will result in bondage.

Praise God that Jesus Christ not only paid the price for our sins. He also defeated the enemey and has given the Christian authority over the powers of darkness.

Mike



_________________
Mike

 2011/7/25 9:11Profile









 Re:

I feel the need to maybe make clearer what I believe on this topic and pray I can express it all clearly enough. I probably should have had another cup of coffee first though. :)

My firm conviction is that in order to help a person that is not "behaving properly" [for a lack of a better term] or has problems stemming from sin in their life, is that the gifts of the Spirit desperately Need to be operating.

None of us can diagnose. The LORD Himself gives the gift of "discerning of spirits" before He uses someone in "delivance".

With the unsaved world - their cure-all is always the same answer - "Medication".

I fear that the Church is beginning to go to a one-size-fits-all "help or cure" as well - "Cast out demons".

A familiar spirit can work through ANY Christian, but of course the spirit is not "in" them. A familiar just speaks a suggestion into someone's mind and they speak out from what they have received into their thoughts. It could work through a manipulative type personality or it can speak right to the heart of someone who is hurting emotionally in one particular area. Demons are 'familiar' with everyone who's ever lived and would know how to Really Hurt another person by speaking a lie through someone else that hits a very tender spot in the person's already wounded heart - a wound that may have been hit since childhood but only the [familiar] spirit knows that tender spot. This is not fighting "flesh and blood" when it comes out of the mouth of a "fellow believer", but this is just an example of one time that a Christian would need that "discerning of spirits" to know that a fellow Christian was just used as a mouth piece for the enemy.
This would be a milder case of demonic activity within the Body of Christ, of course.

As you know, I do not believe that a truly Saved and regenerated Christian can have demons "in" them, but can be influenced by the demonic in many ways. 'Doctrinally' - just for one way, as it is written in The Word.

If every thought is not taken captive to the obedience of Christ and the mind is not renewed by His Word, the mind is open to demonic suggestions. Whether the person follows through on those suggestions is the crux of whether they'll have victory over the enemy or not.

Irrational behavior coming out of a Christian can be caused by "oppression" by the enemy but all "oppression" stems from believing a lie against His Word. This is broken By The Word of GOD and the renewing of the mind. Resist the devil and he will flee. The mind is the battle field and only His Word renews the mind and the reason that the Spirit of Truth was given to us - to lead us into all truth.

We must still and always take responsibility for our own thoughts and actions. That was the point of my last two posts and not to take away from demonic activity.

But the main point I felt to say again, as I said on an earlier thread - that the gift of 'discerning of spirits', a 'word of knowledge and or wisdom' are very much needed in the Church, so that we don't become like the world with a one-size-fits-all "cure" for every phenomena.
I very strongly believe in the gifts of the spirit, but because they've been so mangled and counterfeited in the last couple decades, I've shyed away from openly discussing them that much.

Only The Holy Spirit can diagnose [so to speak] exactly 'what' we're dealing with. That dependence on GOD is so essential in these last days and the days to come.
There are no 'pat answers' when in the ministry. As in the Bible - Each Case is Different and only the Holy Spirit of GOD can give the right 'diagnosis' of what is troubling someone.

IF they are a true Believer and we say that they need a demon "cast out of them", we can destroy their faith or confidence in the Love and Keeping Power of Jesus Christ.

IF we know for certain that a person is 'still' saved, despite the level of sin that they've allowed themselves to sink into - to "cast demons out of them" would be "blame shifting" and weaken them spiritually rather than helping them.

But if the person is not showing any sing/fruit of salvation - then we know that the Holy Spirit can be trusted in this situation as well, to determine what we're dealing with and we have the "Authority" of Jesus to "cast out demons".

I just fear that we're becoming like the world with a one-size-fits-all solution to every man's problems.
That we're neglecting total dependence on The Holy Spirit and not seeing each person as the individual that they are and how Jesus and His Apostles dealt differently with each individual with 'knowledge' directly from The Holy Spirit.
That we're losing that total dependence on the Holy Spirit to give that word of knowledge or discernment of exactly what is wrong with each person, individually, and are coming up with basically pat-answers to all.

IF we tell someone that they need demons cast 'out' of them and that is Not the case - we've done much more damage to that person's mind and spirit then we can even begin to imagine and that is a Biblical fact. We may not be with them after the "deliverance", to see what happens to their minds, down the road, but GOD will hold us responsible for going beyond What is Written and HIS wisdom on that individual.

IF the person is still saved, despite their 'problems' and we tell them it's a demon 'inside' of them - I can't begin to tell you how many have been permentently affected by this approach. I've said it before, but many have lost the faith and were institutionalized by this one-size-fits-all approach to sin or problems in a believer's life.

What makes the true workings of the Church different than any other belief system on earth is the working of The Holy Spirit, with words of knowledge, wisdom, discernment and a Sure word of what exactly is going on with an individual - as each individual is as different as each snow flake is.
HE knows the type of life and childhood, from the womb, that each person has had. He knows where any demonic influence came to a person through lies that they believed.
He knows the person's thoughts. He knows if the person is being genuine or not. He knows every secret of the heart of each of us. So only HE can diagnose/discern anyone's 'problems'.

IF we begin to minister without that total dependence on His Spirit of Truth and His working knowledge of each individual that we minister to - then we're ministering in the flesh and dealing with demons in the flesh and that is dangerous to all concerned -- even the loved ones of the individual who needs HIS help.

We're to be as a little child in complete dependence on Him and what He knows about each individual, in order to deal with such weighty spiritual phenomena and that's what I fear in some of these "spiritual warfare" teachings that we've seen crop up, but that are not from His N.T. - our only Hand Book for Spiritual things.

Just speaking generally here and not about anyone mentioned on this thread that needs His intervention. Just what I've seen go on in the "delivance ministries" that are not fully broken themselves and do not depend soley on The Spirit of Truth to 'diagnose' each individuals 'spiritual or physical' problem and how horrendously dangerous it is to not do so.


Praying for complete dependence on Him and His Living Word.

 2011/7/25 12:55
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3530
Louisiana

 Re:

"Only The Holy Spirit can diagnose [so to speak] exactly 'what' we're dealing with. That dependence on GOD is so essential in these last days and the days to come.
There are no 'pat answers' when in the ministry. As in the Bible - Each Case is Different and only the Holy Spirit of GOD can give the right 'diagnosis' of what is troubling someone."



I agree with you on two main points that you made in your last post.

We need to be totally dependent on the Holy Spirit in helping people. Without trusting Him, and leaning to our own knowledge we are sure to miss it. Anyone who councils people should pray for wisdom and the gift of discernment.

When we go to the doctor, we want him to get the diagnosis right, because if he doesn't he could do more harm than good. Just as you made the point that if a Christian is not being oppressed by demons when there is some other root cause to his problems , and he believes wrongly that demonic oppression is the source, then he will not get any help or deliverance. On the other hand, if there is demonic oppression taking place, then the axe must be laid to the root. All of the counciling in the world will not help one that is being oppressed by evil spirits. Demons do understand the power of the blood and the name of Jesus, and the one that is oppressed must know his authority in Christ.

Mike


_________________
Mike

 2011/7/25 16:28Profile









 Re:

Quote:
When we go to the doctor, we want him to get the diagnosis right, because if he doesn't he could do more harm than good



I understand what you mean, but if you want a guaranteed wrong diagnosis, go to a secular psychiatrist or psychologist and tell him you're hearing voices in your head and that they are telling you evil things to do. I guaratee you will be diagnosed as "Schizophrenic" and given some kind of drugs thereby assuring that you will remain in bondage. Very few people in the medical community have any understand of the working of the demonic. The reason is because there isn't anything they can do to treat it, so they tend to discount it if not outright deny it. The medical community does not specialize in the casting out of demonic spirits by the power of the Holy Spirit. And really not a whole lot of Christian ministries are willing to get involved with this ministry.

 2011/7/25 16:54
staff
Member



Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1448


 Re:

Hi Endzone,Your post brings me back to a question I had earlier below in brackets.

(One other question about casting out demons nowadays in the western world in particular.How does a person (non christian)recognise they have a demon and have them cast out when nobody except christians believe demons exist?)

The point being how can an unbelieving world come to have a demon cast out unless they are a minor brought by a gaurdian.Where does that leave casting out a demon out of a non christian?
Yours Staff

 2011/7/25 17:51Profile
sarahsdream
Member



Joined: 2011/6/16
Posts: 183


 Re:

Hi All,

Thank you all so very much for the discussion and prayers.

Sarah

 2011/7/25 18:03Profile









 Re:


Sarah, I wonder if you could just share the State that he lives in?

 2011/7/25 19:29
sarahsdream
Member



Joined: 2011/6/16
Posts: 183


 Re:

Jesus-isGod,

I'd rather not if you don't mind. We are able to travel, if need be.

Sarah

 2011/7/25 21:50Profile









 Re:

Understandable.

I wanted to give you my email address, but can't with no PMs.

Praying for him, Sis, and have been. Read Mark 7:29,30.



GOD's Blessings to you & All of yours, in Christ Jesus our LORD.

 2011/7/25 22:09





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