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bibleseeker
Member



Joined: 2011/1/21
Posts: 21


 :Leave

Don't worry, I'm leaving this forum. You folks love to select what to believe. That's what the Lord calls smooth things. The truths I posted have been ignored and I have been attacked because the Bible disagrees completely with "the law was nailed to the cross". I can see that a plain thus saith the Lord is not good enough for the majority. Very little of what I have posted has been my own words. I have stuck to the Word of God. The Bible says I have an obligation to speak the truth and it also says that no scripture is of any private interpretation.

When the Lord comes we will find out who is born again.
I'm sure that God means everything He says to us. If you think I'm argumentative, well you're entitled to your opinion.

One thing I ask of the staff. Please cancel my registry and send me an email verifying said action.

 2011/1/31 1:14Profile
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re: :Leave

bibleseeker.

I don't agree with your beliefs. But to "take your ball and go home" is not in the spirit of Christ.

I ask you to reconsider.

Blessings!


_________________
Christiaan

 2011/1/31 1:23Profile
jimp
Member



Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


 Re:

hi, the sabbath is from friday sundown to saturday sundown and that is the truth.in order to keep the sabbath one should have prayers at the candle lighting at friday sundown and not sweat or have any animal or employee sweat til saturday night sundown.one can not drive a vehicle on the sabbath; this is why jews lived in ghettos or in easy slow stroll to the syn....one can see how easy it is to be caught up in the religious beauty of these old testament rituals.i loved friday night services but i loved saturday and sunday services as well.Jesus must be our total salvation or He is not our saviour.Jesus plus circumcission or law is not the way.i rejoice that you hold the proper day as the sabbath but as saved gentiles it really does not matter to God. dead men and women are already in total rest with God through the blood of the Lamb.it is all about Jesus and His life and Him being our place of rest and safety and our source of eternal life.jimp

 2011/1/31 1:23Profile
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7464
Mississippi

 Re:

Chris,

I will try to answer your questions...

To help you understand where I am coming from, I do not for one minute believe the Scriptures teach that by following certain rules or law will earn a body any brownie points with God. All he wants is our devotion and love. In doing so, it will impact ones lifestyle because we will be walking with Him. The Scriptures teach us much what this walk will look like where the rubber meets the road. James 2:26: "For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also."

We understand and know that God gave the Israelites the law as recorded, beginning in Exodus 20. There has been a lot of living that proceeded mankind before this point. Read Genesis up to Exodus 1-19. How did the people live? How did they know what was right and what was wrong? What was their source of information on how this was identified? Noah is described as a preacher of righteousness: what "Bible" did he use? The reality is that we do not know this, but we do know those people knew because they fell under God's judgement for their sin/rebellion. Joseph knew that to give in to Potipher's wife was sin. And that proceeded the law as given in Exodus 20. The concepts as defined in the ten commandments were part of their knowledge on how life should be lived with God.

Jesus teaches us in Mark 2:27,28: "And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: 28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath." (v. 28 hints at his diety). Jesus is saying the sabbath was made for man. God made it for our benefit. Think about it! How is this day different from the other six? Why does man need a day set apart from gainful work/employment? Man needs it, no way around it. We need it for spiritual renewal, we need it for physical renewal as well as mental renewal.

Christian people are very work-driven. We want to be occupied in creating, in producing. But we need to step back and STOP to relax. It is healthier for one spiritually, mentally and physically.

Rest. Do nothing. Stop. I have learned that when I sew (I just love to sew, embroider with my machine - it is not work for me, but a hobby) on the LORD's day, I am more prone to make errors that require more time to correct. I would have been much further ahead to have done NOTHING.

Another example of the principle of resting. The OT law stipulated that when a female was menstruating, she was to be unclean. What ever she touched was to be unclean. Now step back a moment and consider how this impacted ones work...just think about it. It meant she sit and do nothing! and whatever she sat on was to be washed! Chris, do you know it is healthier for a female to take life easy during this time, that it provides her with more energy for the rest of the month? It is resting. Give your fragile body a time to relax. Consider the law regarding a woman who just gave birth. Same thing but you have the added dimension of the mother bonding with the child. I understand that while these laws are not binding for us today, they do teach us a lot about our bodies with its limitations and what we can do to protect this temple wherein God's Spirit dwells.

The story is also said of wagon trains that went west during the 1800s. Some traveled 7 days, others believed one day out of seven should be spent in resting. One wagon master insisted they travel everyday until you get there. Another said "NO!" and didn't. After a while the ones who were resting overtook those who insisted on traveling all week. The ones who rested got there before the others, their animals healthy in contrast to the others who were wore out and/or died.

We do understand there are times when one has to do work on the LORD's day. There are doctors and nurses who care for the sick. There are cows to be milked, chickens to be fed, etc. Several years ago when we were told that a bad hurricane is coming men worked HARD to protect themselves from its onslaught. There were ripe crops in the field waiting to be harvested so they ran their machines as long as they could - 24 hours a day, including Sunday. They ran them non-stop until humidity/rain stopped them or after they they got it all done. Actually, I think they got it all harvested before the hurricane got here. (If a heavy wind with rain hits a ripe crop it will destroy it - knocking the ripe grain off the plants.)

Chris, we need to take time out of our busy schedules to reflect on Man's relationship with his creator. Sure, we do it all day long, but there is something to be said about ceasing from gainful employment one day a week.

We know that violation of the observance of the LORD's day is not listed in the category of sins. However, as we look at life God gave us brains to help us understand that emergencies and needs arise that need to be dealt with immediately. Mercy and love need to rule the day. Unfortunately, the Pharisees made this day hard for people, but this is not God's way. May I suggest that as we consider life in light of the entire written WORD that we take lessons, knowing full well that when God says "do this" or "do not do that" it was for our own good. Always. Doing it God's way means Jesus is yoked together with us enabling us to do it better, doing it His way. It is when we choose to plow/pull without him yoked together with us that we run into trouble.

Do you understand what I am saying, Chris?

ginnyrose


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2011/1/31 9:48Profile
Faith1
Member



Joined: 2011/1/23
Posts: 18


 Re:

I have to say I am shocked at the turn this topic has taken.

For all you "Christian" people to turn on bibleseeker just because he does not agree with you is shameful. If he has offended you, so what? Were is your spirit of love? If Christ is truly in you, then why are you offended?


Psalms 119:165-167 KJV
(165) Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them.
(166) LORD, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments.
(167) My soul hath kept thy testimonies; and I love them exceedingly.


I am not SDA, I am just a person who wants to keep the seventh-day Sabbath, the day God chose in Genesis before sin entered into the world, before there were Jews or Pharisees. I have not judged you for what day you keep or what church you attend.

But I have not received a thoughtful response to any of my posts. I respect your freedom to choose what you believe. Someone has tried to get me to respond in such a fashion as to be able to accuse me of condemning others for not following what I believe. This I will not do.

I have no interest in anyone following me, we are to follow Jesus and He always did those things that pleased his Father.

The question I am waiting to hear any honest answer to is the following:

Which of the 10 commandments is no longer valid?
Are you telling me I can:
have other gods
worship idols
take the Lord's name in vain
keep any day holy
dishonor my parents
kill
commit adultery
steal
lie
covet my neighbour's possessions and family

Now if the law is gone then I can do all those thing above without penalty.

But if it is wrong to do those things, what makes it wrong, because man said so or because God said so?

Or do I just keep the ones I can and forget about the rest?

Isaiah 42:21 KJV
(21) The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.

My choice is to keep all the law in the power and spirit of Christ, of myself I can do nothing.

I respect your freedom to believe as you wish and I pray that you will be more open to others.







 2011/1/31 21:54Profile









 Re:

Quote:
faith1 wrote:

I have to say I am shocked at the turn this topic has taken.

For all you "Christian" people to turn on bibleseeker just because he does not agree with you is shameful. If he has offended you, so what? Were is your spirit of love? If Christ is truly in you, then why are you offended?


I have no interest in anyone following me, we are to follow Jesus and He always did those things that pleased his Father.


I respect your freedom to believe as you wish and I pray that you will be more open to others.




As far as why this thread was started and why anyone would bring this topic up to "Protestants" who fellowship on Sundays - it's apparent that it IS to 'change minds'.

As long as the posts continued from the "Saturday only" stand-point, yes - it was to change minds and the "love" is what has successfully seperated the Body.

That is all that the "Saturday" people have done.

Not satisfied with the repeated posting of - Romans 14.

Why would anyone come onto a "Protestant" website and open this can of worms? Was This "Love"?

Birds of a feather flock together and if you cannot see why the frustration mounted by this previous page - then this topic is blinding you to the point that you cannot see why it in fact 'is' an attempt to force your view.

"Love" does fulfill all the law and the prophets.

Jesus did technically break the Sabbath and allowed his disciples to.

IF you are stating that those who do not observe Saturday but Sunday are breaking the ten commandments - then Who is Judging who?

I do not see the love in starting a thread like this on a site like this UNLESS there is the need of some to convert the "protestants" to Saturday observance rather than their Sundays.

I had a nice and friendly PM session with bibleseeker early in this thread and I have zero problems with those who observe Saturdays as their day of REST and keeping it HOLY Unto The LORD - but when it began to get aggressive on this previous page - I felt I needed to once again present Romans 14 and the question - WHY Divide The Body?

Who - in all truth is attempting to bring division on this website?

The person who started this thread.

WE have no problem with those who observe Saturdays over Sundays and hold to Romans 14 in order to maintain the peace.
What is continuing on this thread? - but an attempt to change the minds of the majority here! So the sentences I quoted of your post are not in truth.

This topic should be taboo for the plain and simple reason that it is 'knowingly' divisive on a website like this one - 'knowingly divisive' --- whereas "love is the fulfilment of all the Law and the prophets."
Your persistance and theirs is proof that none of you "respect" any Sunday worshipper's 'freedom'.

Which makes your last post nothing but words of spiritual pride, rather than "love" - "respect" - or 'Not condemning of Sunday Christians' - because you've made Saturday the only day that they can Keep Holy unto The LORD and refrain from "work".

 2011/1/31 23:28









 Re:


I did not get involved in this thread except to first commend bibleseeker for his "deeds" that he performs on Saturdays.

In our PMs, he said that he owns a business and DOES WORK on Saturdays but just doesn't "charge his customers" on that day. I commended him for not charging them - but if you want to Really follow the Law - he is Breaking it.

I had nothing against bibleseeker - and the "false prophet" thread where he signed on is proof of that - besides all of my other posts to him - Until he questioned a long-time sister here - on this previous page.

Let's be truthful here - the Commandment of Keeping the Sabbath says NO WORK.

There have been other appeals for "peace" and "love" - but they have gone unheeded.

According to the posts of the Saturday keepers - the bottomline is that the Sunday "Protestants" are breaking the 10 Commandments.

A heavy charge when some of them do not - In Truth - observe it as it's been written themselves.
They've cut out what "keeping a Saturday Sabbath" Truly contains in the Law.
I live in a predominantly Jewish area and I know what that Law means and how it is observed.
They do not keep it in the same manner as these Gentile-Christians do, who do not observe all of the Torah neither and the saddest part is, that, not only would they be 'put-off' by a thread like this, but so would any other non-Christian religion or non-believer.
Put-off means - we've destroyed the witness of His Body.

By what, shall all men know that we are His disciples?

Rom 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.
Rom 14:7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.
Rom 14:8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.
Rom 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
Rom 14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
Rom 14:12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
Rom 14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.


Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

 2011/2/1 0:13
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Bravo Jesus-is-God. Your last two posts speak volumes. Thank you.


_________________
Christiaan

 2011/2/1 0:38Profile
mguldner
Member



Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860
Kansas

 Re:

"As for the 10 Commandments they too are done way with. :) We are given but TWO Commands Love the Lord, Your God with all your heart with all your soul with all your mind and with all your strength and Love your neighbor as yourself. Under these two Laws we keep all the Laws but are Free through Grace to operate under and through these two laws."

I have noticed some response to this and understand why one would think its blasphemy. Perhaps some clarity would help. If we Love God and our neighbor we are keeping the 10 commandments, The two laws Christ gave Love the Lord and Love thy Neighbor covers all the commandments.

If I love you and God Im not going to Kill you, Steal from you, commit adultery with your spouse, Lie to you. I believe the Power of these two commandments goes way farther than what the Law goes and even covers all sin against God and man. In this sense we have but two Laws the ones I have listed as for the rest they will be covered and taken care of with just these two commands.


_________________
Matthew Guldner

 2011/2/1 3:28Profile
RainMan
Member



Joined: 2010/4/21
Posts: 227


 Re: Blindness




6[It is He] Who has qualified us [making us to be fit and worthy and sufficient] as ministers and dispensers of a new covenant [of salvation through Christ], not [ministers] of the letter (of legally written code) but of the Spirit; for the code [of the Law] kills, but the [Holy] Spirit makes alive.(B)

7Now if the dispensation of death engraved in letters on stone [the ministration of the Law], was inaugurated with such glory and splendor that the Israelites were not able to look steadily at the face of Moses because of its brilliance, [a glory] that was to fade and pass away,(C)

8Why should not the dispensation of the Spirit [this spiritual [b]ministry whose task it is to cause men to obtain and be governed by the Holy Spirit] be attended with much greater and more splendid glory?

9For if the service that condemns [the ministration of doom] had glory, how infinitely more abounding in splendor and glory must be the service that makes righteous [the ministry that produces and fosters righteous living and right standing with God]!

10Indeed, in view of this fact, what once had splendor [[c]the glory of the Law in the face of Moses] has come to have no splendor at all, because of the overwhelming glory that exceeds and excels it [[d]the glory of the Gospel in the face of Jesus Christ].

11For if that which was but passing and fading away came with splendor, how much more must that which remains and is permanent abide in glory and splendor!

12Since we have such [glorious] hope (such joyful and confident expectation), we speak very freely and openly and fearlessly.

13Nor [do we act] like Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the Israelites might not gaze upon the finish of the vanishing [splendor which had been upon it].

14In fact, their minds were grown hard and calloused [they had become dull and had lost the power of understanding]; for until this present day, when the Old Testament (the old covenant) is being read, that same veil still lies [on their hearts], not being lifted [to reveal] that in Christ it is made void and done away.

15Yes, down to this [very] day whenever Moses is read, a veil lies upon their minds and hearts.

16But whenever a person turns [in repentance] to the Lord, the veil is stripped off and taken away.

17Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty (emancipation from bondage, freedom).(D)

18And all of us, as with unveiled face, [because we] continued to behold [in the Word of God] as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are constantly being transfigured into His very own image in ever increasing splendor and from one degree of glory to another; [for this comes] from the Lord [Who is] the Spirit.


 2011/2/1 5:36Profile





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