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 Re:

Leo writes......

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

Wow brother, I do not think I have ever disagreed more with a statement on SI than this one. God bless you...........brother Frank

PS If Calvary does not represent Love, and a defeat of Satan, then I would not even know how to have a discussion with someone who did not believe that Calvary was a triumph of Love and forgiveness.

 2009/12/19 12:53
Leo_Grace
Member



Joined: 2009/6/14
Posts: 703


 Re:

Quote:

appolus wrote:
Leo writes......

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

Wow brother, I do not think I have ever disagreed more with a statement on SI than this one. God bless you...........brother Frank

PS If Calvary does not represent Love, and a defeat of Satan, then I would not even know how to have a discussion with someone who did not believe that Calvary was a triumph of Love and forgiveness.


Dear Frank,

Maybe I could have chosen better words to convey my meaning. Calvary was a victory of LOVE that is true, but it is God's love for man, not God's love for Satan. Big difference, don't you think?

In the same way, Christians should be motivated in their actions by LOVE for God and LOVE for fellow men, not just LOVE per se, which some would take to mean not resisting evil at all. The Bible is clear that we must resist evil in all its forms. Love must have an object, and it is the object that makes LOVE a thing of God or a thing of the devil (LOVE of money).

When we lift the banner of LOVE, we must be clear that love cannot be exercised with no object in mind. Scripturally, the objects of our love are God and fellowmen; not evil, never evil.

If you truly love God, then there are some things that you can never love (sin, evil, Satan, injustice, cruelty, oppression, hypocrisy, etc.). If you love God, you would do as he commands and oppose these evils to the best of your ability. When you think that you should "not resist" these evils out of love, you have lost your first love.

 2009/12/19 13:16Profile









 Re:



Dear Appolos:

In studying the Ten Commandments, the commandment Thou shall not kill should actually read [color=990000][b]Thou shalt not Murder. [/color][/b]

The commandment "thou shall not kill" (Exodus 20:13; Deuteronomy 5:17), is better understood to mean "you shall not murder." Most modern translations of the Bible rendered it this way.

According to the Bible not all killing, the taking of a life, is murder. Murder is the unlawfully taking of human life. The command not to murder applies to human beings, not to killing animals or plant life for food. God gave animals to mankind for his use (Genesis 1:26-30; 9:1-4). But, this does not mean that humans have the right mistreat animals and the environment (Genesis 2:15; Deuteronomy 22:6-7; 25:4; Proverbs 12:10).

Under the Old Covenant God allowed the Israelites to kill other humans under very special circumstances such as punishment for certain sins, for example, murder (Exodus 21:12-14, Leviticus 24:17, 21) and adultery (Leviticus 20:10, Deuteronomy 22:22-24). God also allowed the Israelites to engage in warfare and even gave them instructions about waging war (Deuteronomy 20:1-20). God also recognized that humans might accidentally kill each other, and he made provisions for this (Numbers 35:9-34; Deuteronomy 19:1-13).

The primary reason God hates murder (to lie in wait, and purposely kill another human being) is that out of all creation, only human are made in the image of God (Genesis 1:26-27; 9:4-6). Even before the codification of the Ten Commandments at Mount Sinai the murder of other human beings was wrong (Genesis 4:8-12; 4:23-24; 9:4-6; Exodus 1:16-17). While on earth, Jesus spoke out against murder (Matthew 5:21-26; Mark 10:17-19). We also see in the writings of Paul (Romans 1:18, 29-32; 13:8-10; Galatians 5:19-21), James (James 2:8-11; 4:1-3), Peter (1 Peter 4:15-16) and John (Revelation 9:20-21; 21:7-8; 22:14-15) that murder is wrong.

[color=990000][b]If anyone is intent on murdering me, or any member of my family, please understand that it is my God given duty to defend them, as well as myself, even if it results in their death, or my own death. Only a coward or a timid fool would not defend himself/herself and/or his/her family.[/color][/b]

Sincerely,

Walter

Quote:

appolus wrote:
Leo writes......

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

Wow brother, I do not think I have ever disagreed more with a statement on SI than this one. God bless you...........brother Frank

PS If Calvary does not represent Love, and a defeat of Satan, then I would not even know how to have a discussion with someone who did not believe that Calvary was a triumph of Love and forgiveness.

 2009/12/19 14:02









 Re:

Hi Waltern,

My specific issue was with this statement........

Leo writes......

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

Do you agree with that statement?.......Frank

 2009/12/19 14:26
Leo_Grace
Member



Joined: 2009/6/14
Posts: 703


 Re:

Quote:

appolus wrote:
Hi Waltern,

My specific issue was with this statement........

Leo writes......

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

Do you agree with that statement?.......Frank



Frank,

Please read the whole post and also the last one I made in response to your objection.

Leo

 2009/12/19 14:52Profile
ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Dear friends,


Quote:
The only way that Satan can be defeated is by the love of Christ.



I do not think that Heartsong meant that we are to love Satan. I think that what she meant was that love is how we will defeat him: his devices, his strategies against God and man, his power over others and what he would try to use on ourselves.



It may not be described as our weapon or armor in the scriptures and it need not be. It is rather called the bond of perfection(greek:joint tie, ligament).

I suppose then that any Christian warrior not fitted in armor tied together in love is not ready for battle.


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2009/12/19 15:12Profile









 Re:



Dear Appolus:



My specific objection is to your position (pacifism).

Do you believe that God gives you the right to defend your family and yourself against anyone who wants to destroy your family and/or yourself?

That is the issue here, that you will not discuss.


Sincerely,

Walter

Quote:

appolus wrote:
Hi Waltern,

My specific issue was with this statement........

Leo writes......

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

Do you agree with that statement?.......Frank

 2009/12/19 15:28









 Re:

HI Waltern, respectfully, I did not jump back into this post to rehash what has already been said, I believe it would be fruitless. I can agree to disagree with you on this subject and I respect your right to have any position that you have. However, as I said, I do not believe I have ever disagreed more with a commnet from a regular on SI than this statement........

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."

 2009/12/19 17:44
MaryJane
Member



Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

Greeting Leo

You wrote: If you truly love God, then there are some things that you can never love (sin, evil, Satan, injustice, cruelty, oppression, hypocrisy, etc.). If you love God, you would do as he commands and oppose these evils to the best of your ability. When you think that you should "not resist" these evils out of love, you have lost your first love.
___

I think I see what you are saying with this. I agree that when we are commanded to love that does not include the evil of sin. We are called to view sin as the Father does and He views all sin as wicked and evil. I think that we should resist evil absolutely, however I do not think that means that we have to take up arms and seek to cause harm to the persons.

God Bless
mj

 2009/12/19 18:02Profile









 Re:



Dear Appolus (Frank):

Your question should be directed to the person who made it to you, not to me.

I am not Leo (Leo_Grace). He is the one that made the statement.

Sincerely,

Walter

Quote:

appolus wrote:
HI Waltern, respectfully, I did not jump back into this post to rehash what has already been said, I believe it would be fruitless. I can agree to disagree with you on this subject and I respect your right to have any position that you have. However, as I said, I do not believe I have ever disagreed more with a commnet from a regular on SI than this statement........

"Love is not a weapon to be wielded against Satan. It is not part of the armor of God. Our weapons against evil are: truth, righteousness, the gospel of peace, faith, our salvation, the word of God, and prayer. With these weapons we are to fight Satan and defeat him."


 2009/12/19 18:16





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