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murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Go and sin no more

John 8:11
"She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more."

John 5:14
"Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee."

I guess the strongest argument is that impossible not to sin. But why would Jesus say, "Sin no more" in John 5:14 and 8:11. Is Jesus being facetious because He knew it was impossible to do? Does he mean, don't do a particular sin any more?

But there is no getting away from the fact, God expects us to stop sinning. God expects prefeection in our lives.

"Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect."
Matthew 5:48

"Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you."
Philippians 3:15

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God."
2Corinthians 7:1

Sinlessness and perfection I rememebr talking to a Pastor about these things and he said it's impossible that we will never attain this in this life.

My belief is that it is possible to live a life where we "sin no more" although I cannot say it's a fact in my life, what do you believe and why?


_________________
Colin Murray

 2009/8/20 16:50Profile
Lordoitagain
Member



Joined: 2008/5/23
Posts: 611
Monroe, LA - USA

 Re: Go and sin no more

1 Thessalonians 5:23  ¶And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
24  Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.


Would blameless and sinless be synonyms?

If he would preserve the Thesalonians blameless unto the coming of our Lord . . . why would he not do the same for us?

If perfect means fully mature, then surely none of us will be that until we awake in His likeness Psalms 17:15 on the other side.

If blameless means not guilty of willfully, knowingly disobeying His will, and repenting when we discover that we have unknowingly disobeyed . . . that state of life is not only possible, it SHOULD BE the norm.


1 Corinthians 15:57  But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 John 5:4  For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.
5  Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?


Galatians 2:20  I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Galatians 5:16  This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.




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Michael Strickland

 2009/8/20 18:26Profile
bobhickman
Member



Joined: 2009/8/20
Posts: 1


 Re: Go and sin no more

prayforbob, Holy Ghost baptizm feels like a body your perfect size coming in, touch me and get shocked, lest, and then killed all day long persectution, and thats the Lord making me weak by manifold temptations like electricity causing itching on scalp, flowing on what I use bathroom out of, spiking, caressing, gum desease, terrified in visions, seeing Jesus in visions and him lauhging, at me, saying things like, run from me, backslide, perish for the bretherns sake http://www.prophetic.beep.com

 2009/8/20 18:50Profile
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Quote:
The Good News is that God has already provided the solution for this in Christ. Christ crucified you when He died and you were buried with Him. When you were born again, the old you died and you received Christ's Life. If you are a Christian then you become one with Him. He made you a NEW CREATION. You were made 100% righteous and perfect. You are one with Holy Spirit or the Spirit of Christ. You are no longer a sinner; you now have a new pure heart and God's very Divine Nature.



I have put up this quote as to what I was taught as a Babe in Christ and this is what I belived but know I find myself challenging this teaching. Why because there seems to be a part of me that like a magnet which always aligns to the North, I find in me something that would always cause me to sin. I might try and resist but inside theres something that pulls me in another direction.

I found out that I was alive to Christ on my conversion, but as I went on I find that the old man did not die as I have been taught. It is him warring within it is him that is opposed to the things of God while he lives I can only dream of being able to fulfill Christs command of [b]"Go and sin no more"[/b]


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Colin Murray

 2009/8/20 21:47Profile









 Re:

I completely agree.

Why would Jesus say, "go and sin no more" unless it was possible? Why would God say "thou shalt not" at threat of eternal hell, unless we were capable? God is not a cruel tyrant. Jesus said, "be ye perfect" and he meant it! It is sad that so many theologians will jump through exegetical hoops just to conclude that Jesus didn't mean what he said!

God certainly does expect us to stop sinning. God doesn't want us to sin and therefore God gives us the ability or option of not sinning - 1 Cor. 10:13. Unless God wants us to sin, why wouldn't He give us the ability to stop sinning?

The fact remains that it is "possibe" to be morally perfect or to stop sinning, even if nobody does it! Even if the whole world sins, that does not negate the fact that it is possible not to sin.

I like what Leonard Ravenhill used to say, "I am not saying that it is impossible for us to sin. I am saying that it is possible for us not to sin."

Duncan Campbell said, "You will never get to the place in your life where it is impossible for you to sin. But thanks be to God that you are in a position where it is possible for you not to."

If we could not be free from sin in this life, I wouldn't want to live any longer! I'd be so depressed and so miserable! But God not only wants to save us from the penalty of sin, He also wants to save us from the practice of sin! Death is not the Savior. Jesus Christ is a present Savior, who can save us from all of our sins.

Many put off their sanctification until glorification. They say, "we can't be free from sin in this life, we have to wait until we get a glorified body". That is Gnosticism. The Gnostics denied that Jesus Christ came in the flesh because to them, the flesh was a sin! To them, sin was a substance of matter, not a choice of the will. The truth is, glorification is physical perfection. Sanctification is moral perfection. We cannot have a perfect body in this life, but we can have a pefect heart. We cannot have a glorified body in this life, but we can have a sanctified body in this life.

 2009/8/21 1:55
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Does the Spirit of Christ sin? Absolutely not.

Does the Holy Spirit sin? Absolutely not.

Where is the Spirit of Christ?

Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His.

Colossians 1:27-28 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:

How are we perfect? "In Christ", by the Christ birthed of the Father in us.

We are perfectly saved in the Spirit of Christ.

We are being saved in our soul, where the Holy Spirit works bringing our minds to the Mind of
Christ, "predestinated to be conformed to the image of Christ".

1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Romans 8:29 For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren.

We are saved and without sin in spirit, by the Spirit of Christ in us.

We are being or doth save Present tense, us in our soul.

We will be saved in body on resurrection morning, until then it is quickened to contain the Spirit of Christ, the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of God our Father.

2 Corinthians 1:10 Who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that he will yet deliver us;

Jesus will never laugh and any of His brethren.

It is old sloo-foot, the dragon as an angle of light who is laughing at us who is saying there is Christ, Here is Christ, I am Christ, to take us away from the Christ that is in us and defeat the Fathers rebirthing of Christ in His born again son'.

Even Paul knew this very well and states it many times in his letters to the Gentiles... "Who will set me free from this body of death"?

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2009/8/21 3:42Profile









 Re:

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

 2009/8/21 5:37
narrowpath
Member



Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1099
Germany NRW

 Re: Go and sin no more

I think what Jesus means is to leave your life of sin. Rigtheousness is now the standard and sin the regretful exception.

 2009/8/21 7:29Profile
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Quote:

paulmcg1 wrote:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.



Paul this was on another post the brother who posted it gives a very good answer to your question.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't take that verse out of context.

1. This passage must always be looked at in context. The entire book of John must be consulted, especially verses 1:7-10, 2:1. Those who isolate this passage usually twist its meaning to be contrary to the rest of the epistle which is about moral perfection. The meaning of a verse is always lost or misunderstood when scripture isolation is practiced. The immediately surrounding context gives us much clarity into this verse.

2. The phrase, "have no sin" in verse 8 could mean two things. It could mean "have no sin" in your present conduct, or it could mean "have no sin" on your record. Verse 10 is very clear that John is talking about those who deny having any disobedience on their record by saying "If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." None can deny that they have sinned or disobeyed in the past, but Christians can say that they presently obey God.

3. Verse 7 and 9 promise, not merely the pardon of sin, but also cleansing from sin. There is a proper distinction made between forgiveness and cleansing, “to forgive us our sins, AND to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” These passages promise not only forgiveness of sin but also freedom from sin. They promise freedom, not merely from some sins, but freedom from "all" sins, "to cleanse us from ALL unrighteousness".

4. The man spoken of in verse 8 is the man who had not yet experienced verse 9. That is, the deceived man who denies having any sin is the one who has not yet confessed their sins, been forgiven of their sins, and has had their sins cleansed out of their life. Verse 8 is directed to, or specifically talking about, the man who has not yet been forgiven and cleansed as described in verse 9. Verse 9 is written as the solution to the sin described in verse 8.

5. If 1:8 means that nobody can state that Jesus Christ has cleansed them from all sin, then saying that you have experienced 1:9 makes you a liar. This interpretation of 1:8 would mean that believing 1:9 would make you “deceived”.

6. If "have no sin" means that no Christian can state as Paul did that we are presently "free from sin" (Romans 6:22), then John immediately contradicts his purpose as stated in 2:1, "these things write I unto you, that ye sin not." This interpretation would mean that John was writing this epistle so that we would “deceive ourselves” and so that “the truth” would not be “in us”. Why would John write them so that they “sin not” if when they believe that they “sin not” they are simply “deceived” without “the truth”?

7. If 1:8 means that you are a liar if you claim to presently keep God's commandments, then 2:3-4 is a total contradiction. These passages state that "we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him." Such an interpretation would amount to this: if you claim to keep God's commandments, you are a liar and the truth is not in you (1:8), but if you claim to know God but do not keep His commandments, you are a liar and the truth is not in you (2:4). So the truth would not be in the one who claims to keep God's commandments, and the truth would not be in the one who says they know God yet breaks His commandments. Then the only logical conclusion would be that nobody knows God, if the Bible teaches that everyone presently breaks God’s commandments and you cannot know God if you presently break His commandments.

8. If 1:8 means that we all always have sin in our lives, then we do not "abideth in him" and have "not seen him, neither known him" according to 3:6, we are all "of the devil" according to 3:8, and we have not been born of God according to 3:9.

9. If 1:8 means that you are a liar if you state that you no longer break God's commandments, then the Apostle John is a liar because he says "we keep his commandments and do those things that are pleasing in his sight" in 3:22. According to the popular interpretation of 1:8, this would make the Apostle “deceived”, it would mean that the Apostle was without “the truth” because he claimed to “keep his commandments”.

10. The difference between the children of God and the children of the devil, is that the children of God do what is righteous, but the children of the devil commit sin, according to 3:8-10. This could not be a proper or accurate distinction if 1:8 means that everyone converted or not has present disobedience in their life.

11. The meaning of this passage is clear: If a man claims that they have never sinned, that they have no sin on their record, they are deceived. But if they confess that they have sinned, their sin can be both forgiven and cleansed out of their lives, so that they will walk in holiness and righteousness.


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Colin Murray

 2009/8/21 18:46Profile
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Quote:

narrowpath wrote:
I think what Jesus means is to leave your life of sin. Rigtheousness is now the standard and sin the regretful exception.



If Jesus meant we should leave our life of sin would that mean we should sin no more?


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Colin Murray

 2009/8/21 18:51Profile





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