SermonIndex Audio Sermons
Image Map
Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : CAN BORN AGAIN CHRISTIANS LOOSE SALVATION and END UP IN HELL?

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 Next Page )
PosterThread
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

There is only one reason that Judas was lost.
By the power of God to fulfill the scripture, just like all who are lost.

God does not loose any He chooses for salvation, this to make the Cross of Christ all He intended it to be. By His works we stand or fall, not by our own works, standing and falling in Christ does not mean those that stand or fall are kicked out of the Family, Standing or falling is God's works in the believer for His Grace is sufficent in all circumstances and situations. Falling will be right and in Gods perfect will for the child that is in His arms when He is falling.

Acts 1:16-20 Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus. For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry. Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out. And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood. For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

The fulfillment of Psalms and the reason for Judas.

John 17:12-26 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves. I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil. They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth. Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world. O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me. And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.

That we might be in Him that lovedst us and we be in Him and in God the Father, with the Holy Spirit Comforter teaching us all that the scripture says about Jesus Christ and what He says.

Jesus Christ has defeated satan on the Cross, and none can be like Judas, only thorns in the Flesh and by the Grace of God, to keep us from being puffed up as Paul, for satan has nothing to do with the Christ in us. Our eternal salvation is sure and none will be lost, this by God's choosing and Christ's Keeping.

In Christ forever: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2009/7/18 21:20Profile









 Re:

Ah ha Clintstone! Then we have found yet more common ground of faith and obedience that I knew was there somewhere :-) Thank you for your gracious response. Blessings to you Brother!!!

cc-

 2009/7/18 22:14
yoadam
Member



Joined: 2009/2/10
Posts: 97
OREGON

 Re:

Quote:

kathleen1 wrote:
[b]If it is not possible to lose your salvation then why are there so many warnings in the New Testament given both to the disciples and to the church?[/b]


Hi.

To put it quite simply, in one sense, it is like there is a church within the church. Just like how not everyone under the old covenant was saved, so also not everyone under the new covenant is saved. The scriptures speak of a remnant people. Ie, [i]"For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:"[/i] Rom. 9:6 AND [i]"5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace."[/i] Rom. 11:5 The warnings in scriptures are for those who think they are saved, but in fact are not truly born again. These people in the church must [i]"5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"[/i] 2 Cor. 13:5


_________________
Adam

 2009/7/19 9:04Profile
passerby
Member



Joined: 2008/8/13
Posts: 640


 Re:

Should the Christians doubt their salvation, has not the Lord given us 100% assurance that we will be saved. How much do we have to labor, achieve, or sacrifice before we can be assured of our salvation. How many years of faithfulness before we can be deaclared as 100% save. How much work, how many resolutions do we have to do to seal our eternal destiny? Can we assure ourselves that we will be always faithful to our Lord, just how many years is needed before we commit our next sin.

The sad thing is, it may not take long before we stumble again, even years of being saintly will not assure us that no fault will be found in us. We are but a hopeless case on our own:

Mat 19:25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?

How tragic it will be that after many years of following the Lord, we will suddenly found ourlselves to be an outcast. Can we not tell with confidence that we will not lost our salvation in the future_ that it is not a vain thing to obey the gospel at this very moment, that it is not afterall a mere gamble or simply a play of chance...(to be continued)

 2009/7/20 1:59Profile
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3411
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re: CAN BORN AGAIN CHRISTIANS LOSE SALVATION

Quote:
yoadam wrote:
Just like how not everyone under the old covenant was saved


Now, I'm not arguing but correct me if I'm wrong but no one under the old covenant was saved, were they?

The only two that I know of for sure from Scripture is Enoch and Elijah (oh & poor Lazarus- Abraham's bosom).

Besides these, are there any others that lived a victorious life (without Christ & Holy Spirit), proven through the Scriptures?

[i]Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.[/i]
Galatians 3.21

I'm not trying to argue with you, I'd really like to know!

God bless you!


_________________
Lisa

 2009/7/20 7:09Profile
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991
Sweden

 Re:

Quote:

Lysa wrote:
Quote:
yoadam wrote:
Just like how not everyone under the old covenant was saved


Now, I'm not arguing but correct me if I'm wrong but no one under the old covenant was saved, were they?

The only two that I know of for sure from Scripture is Enoch and Elijah (oh & poor Lazarus- Abraham's bosom).

Besides these, are there any others that lived a victorious life (without Christ & Holy Spirit), proven through the Scriptures?

[i]Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.[/i]
Galatians 3.21

I'm not trying to argue with you, I'd really like to know!

God bless you!




in OT we have all of israel as a picture of Gods "saved" people, they where saved out of egypt, God worked miracles he lead the day and night, he dwellet among them, he fed them daily etc. God elected them, he chose them, he gave them commands and the law to follow. Paul gives us this example and warns us to be like them who ended up dead in the desert and never reaching the promise land, other people worth studying that i consider had a victorious life was Job, God gave the testimony that he was righteous.

we should be glad we have a better covenant then israel did, but we can also just as they did neglect a so great salvation.

1Co 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
1Co 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
1Co 10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
1Co 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
1Co 10:5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
1Co 10:6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.
1Co 10:7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
1Co 10:8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
1Co 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Co 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.



they drank spiritually from Christ.... yet they never entered into the promise land. How can you drink from Christ the living water and not be saved? this is written for our admonition and example. Let us make our election and calling sure, israel did not, let us hold fast in faith, israel did not, let us press on towards perfection, israel did not. Let us not be like them, we have a better covenant by Gods goodness and grace.


_________________
CHRISTIAN

 2009/7/20 8:05Profile
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3411
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re: CAN BORN AGAIN CHRISTIANS LOOSE SALVATION

Quote:
passerby wrote:
Should the Christians doubt their salvation...


I do not go around doubting my salvation and I have stumbled but I know that we (I) have an advocate with Jesus Christ the Righteous! (1 John 2.1)

I am not talking about sins that I don't know that I committed! God is not like that, He doesn't punish us for being a new Christian and not knowing something.

Ahhh, but if we know!! [i]If you or I [b]KNOW[/b] to do good and we don't do it, it's a sin[/i] (James 4.17). And if we do not repent of it, it is not forgiven. Do you agree with that? That unrepented sin is not forgiven? {NEW Christians: I am NOT talking about a stumbling here and losing your salvation, do not fear!} So if unrepented sin is not forgiven, then how can sin enter into His kingdom?

If you are saying that it does enter His kingdom, please explain this to me. (I am NOT trying to be argumentative, I really would like to know how someone Scripturally explains this.)

In case one might lean on "all of our past, present and future sins are forgiven..." I ask, where in the Scripture does it say that [b]future sins[/b] are forgiven?

I do not know what one has to do to lose their salvation (if in fact they do), maybe they are considered carnal Christians and punished accordingly (that could include me at times). I am truly interested.

Thank you for considering this...


_________________
Lisa

 2009/7/20 8:13Profile
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3411
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re:

Quote:
hmmhmm wrote:
they drank spiritually from Christ.... yet they never entered into the promise land. How can you drink from Christ the living water and not be saved? this is written for our admonition and example. Let us make our election and calling sure, israel did not, let us hold fast in faith, israel did not, let us press on towards perfection, israel did not. Let us not be like them, we have a better covenant by Gods goodness and grace.


This makes sense to me,

Thank you brother!


_________________
Lisa

 2009/7/20 8:16Profile
yoadam
Member



Joined: 2009/2/10
Posts: 97
OREGON

 Re:

Quote:
Quote:

Lysa wrote:
kathleen1 wrote:
[b]If it is not possible to lose your salvation then why are there so many warnings in the New Testament given both to the disciples and to the church?[/b]


Quote:
yoadam wrote:
Hi.

To put it quite simply, in one sense, it is like there is a church within the church. Just like how not everyone under the old covenant was saved, so also not everyone under the new covenant is saved. The scriptures speak of a remnant people. Ie, [i]"For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:"[/i] Rom. 9:6 AND [i]"5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace."[/i] Rom. 11:5 The warnings in scriptures are for those who think they are saved, but in fact are not truly born again. These people in the church must [i]"5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?"[/i] 2 Cor. 13:5


Now, I'm not arguing but correct me if I'm wrong but no one under the old covenant was saved, were they?

The only two that I know of for sure from Scripture is Enoch and Elijah (oh & poor Lazarus- Abraham's bosom).

Besides these, are there any others that lived a victorious life (without Christ & Holy Spirit), proven through the Scriptures?

[i]Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.[/i]
Galatians 3.21

I'm not trying to argue with you, I'd really like to know!

God bless you!


Hello,

Briefly--
The people of God have always been saved by grace.

All one needs to do is examine the sacrificial system of the old testament. Even BEFORE moses, the people of God were burning animal sacrifices to the LORD.

Look at Adam & Eve, after they sinned, they made their own clothes out of plant leaves. Just like the natural man, who after he sins, tries to do good works to cover up his sin and shame. Yet this is not good enough, as the people of God must have a perfect righteousness to stand before a holy God. And so the LORD killed the first animals and gave Adam & Eve clothes of animal skins, which is an amazing picture of their salvation, and justification before God via the righteousness of Christ, not on the basis of their own works, but on the basis of God's grace and a promise of the Messiah who would one day come to redeem the people of God.

As mentioned, there were other people in the old testament who were saved before the time of moses, like Enoch, etc...

Also Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob & the nation of Israel. Of course, as I said earlier, not all of Israel was saved. But of course, God has always had a remnant people who were saved. At the time of Moses, animal sacrifices were officially codified by the law, but the people of God did sacrifice animals before this time as well... Is this not an amazing picture of people being saved by Jesus' blood? If we can believe in Jesus and be saved by His blood, which was shed 2,000 years ago in the past; then what was holding back people from believing in Jesus and being saved by His blood which would be thousands of years later in the future?

Adam :-)


_________________
Adam

 2009/7/20 12:21Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3286
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

MrBillPro wrote:
O sluefoot must be grinning from ear to ear reading this thread. :-(



He has to be rolling on the floor by now. :-)


_________________
Bill

 2009/7/20 15:52Profile





©2002-2020 SermonIndex.net
Promoting Genuine Biblical Revival.
Affiliate Disclosure | Privacy Policy