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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Hebrews 6:4-6

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hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4994
Sweden

 Re:

Solomon wrote three books in Scripture in his lifetime – two of them - Proverbs and Song of Solomon - are like new covenant books in the Old Testament. Proverbs is the finest book in the Old Testament. All young people should read it regularly and frequently. It has 31 chapters. Read a chapter a day and it can preserve you from much evil. Song of Solomon is a wonderful picture of our devotion to Jesus Christ as His bride. Ecclesiastes was written after Solomon had drifted. In it, he warns us about the dangers of worldly wisdom. This man who wrote three wonderful books of the Bible finally went to hell! Don't imagine that everyone who stands up and preaches wonderful sermons will go to heaven.

How do we know that Solomon went to hell? Is it possible that the Holy Spirit would write two biographies of Solomon (1 Kings and 2 Chronicles), and not mention in either of them that he repented towards the end of his life, if he had actually done so. Such silence is very eloquent. It tells us that Solomon died unrepentant. Manasseh was a king who did much greater evil than Solomon, and for a much longer period of time. But at the end of his life he repented, and the Holy Spirit mentions it in Scripture. It is unthinkable that the Holy Spirit would not have mentioned it, if Solomon had repented.

Why are many Christians so keen on "sending Solomon to heaven"? It's because they imagine that anyone who serves the Lord will definitely go to heaven. No matter how they live. Jesus said that many would come to Him on the last day and say, "Lord, we prophesied in Your Name, we cast out demons in Your Name, we did miracles in Your Name." But the Lord will say to them, "Depart from me, you who lived in sin." Solomon will come before the Lord in that day too and say, "Lord, I wrote three books of Scripture that blessed millions of people." And the Lord will tell him also exactly what He tells the others, "Depart from me, you who lived in sin." Let Solomon's life be a warning to all of us. Paul said, "I can preach to others, but be disqualified myself finally" (1Cor.9:27).

Zac Poonen

Excerpt from [url=http://www.cfcindia.com/web/mainpages/word_for_the_week.php?display=06_01&year=07]A strong warning from Solomons backsliding[/url]


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CHRISTIAN

 2008/11/29 2:09Profile
int3grity
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Joined: 2008/10/24
Posts: 76


 Re:

Brother hmmhmm, I am re-posting what I said but without the last paragraph about what Bible1985 said about the book of Hebrews being written to Hebrews.

PLEASE LOOK AT THE PARALLEL PASSAGES AND JUST SEE WHAT THE TEXT SAYS.

You also went on a tyrade on my brother Ricky's post about passive and active work of GOD in salvaion without having even looked at the video that he posted. When he called you out on it you said you already know everything about the subject and don't need to see it so you commented on something you knew nothing about as if you did know but your comments showed you didn't.
Instead of always defending your tradition please look at what the text says or listen to what is being presented. Otherwise it is a case of Proverbs 18:13.

Here is the post again:

If you keep reading on to verses 7-8 you will see it references and parallels JESUS' words in Matthew 7:16-19 about the cofessors of CHRIST who bear bad fruit being thrown into the fire. Compare those passages.

Then in Matthew 7:23 JESUS says, "I NEVER KNEW YOU" - in other words it is a reference to those who were not saved despite their profession ("Lord, Lord") of faith. now go back and keep reading the next verse, Hebrews 6:9- "we are confident of BETTER THINGS in your case-things that accompany SALVATION.

So it is clear that Hebrews 6:4-6 is a reference to false converts. Those who were ONCE (not are) enlightened, Tasted (not partaken of) the Heavenly gift, SHARED (by virtue of being in the fellowship of believers) in the Holy Spirit, TASTED the goodness of the Word and the powers of the coming age but not SAVED since if they were saved and then lost then CHRIST would have to be re-crucified in order to re-save them.


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Ryan

 2008/11/29 2:22Profile
hmmhmm
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Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4994
Sweden

 Re:

First i would like to ask forgivness if anything I wrote is as you say first. I had no intensions of coming forth as such, maybe my limited english somtimes dont really come forth as i think in my mother tongue.

What grieves me is that you all seem to treat scripture as some is for us and some is not, some warnings for us and some not. But all "good" verses are for us.

I do belive one can leave Christ, there are probably hundreds of verses warning born again belivers one can at one point know God in truth, and in the end end up with the unbelivers and wicked in hell forever. Now I respect anyone who interpret scripture different, i can with no problem fellowship and love such people. But I also think not many of you has understand what i have been trying to say, if your reasoning about scripture is right, then who shall determine for me what to take serious and what scriptures are for unbelieving jews?

I will leave this thread since it mostly round and round. I dont want to force my beliefs and doctrine upon anyone, but if as you seem to think, that it dont matter and is of no danger to live in sin. Then it would be waste of time even reading scriptures, for me or for jews, since i can not walk away from God or end up in hell if i am once saved. So wheter i read or not or obey or not are of non effect in eternity.

I meen we have so many warnings throughout scripture, and all the letters to the churches in revelation? they where not written to unbelivers, but to born again christians.

But that is not what i want to leave with here, my beliefs about osas.

but rather that we need to believe what scripture says even when we dont like it, and we need to take it serious, not reason it away, but rather obey it. Even when it goes against our doctrines or traditions as you say.

I wish you all a fruitfull discussion and much edifying. I have given what my heart had to share.

Christian


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CHRISTIAN

 2008/11/29 3:33Profile
HomeFree89
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Joined: 2007/1/21
Posts: 797
Indiana

 Re:

Quote:

int3grity wrote:
hmmhmm that doesn't even make any sense. It is a parallel passage with the one in Matthew 7. regardless of whether they were both written to Jews the point is that there are false professors of CHRIST and it is clear when you look at how the one passage clarifies it's parallel that Hebrews 6:4-6 is not talking about saved people loosing their salvation. In light of so many other passages that show people cannot cease to be new creations in CHRIST, loose eternal life, or become un-born again (The chain of redemption in Rom 8:30, the words of CHRIST in John 6, etc.) it is clear that this is the meaning of Hebrews 6:4-6. There are no irreconcilable paradoxes in the Scriptures.



I don't believe that Hebrews 6 is talking about false professors of Christ. The people in question there had been enlightened, tasted the heavenly gift, and shared in the Holy Spirit.


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Jordan

 2008/11/29 9:54Profile
Miccah
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Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:


hmmhmm wrote:


Quote:
I do belive one can leave Christ, there are probably hundreds of verses warning born again belivers one can at one point know God in truth, and in the end end up with the unbelivers and wicked in hell forever.




I agree with you brother.


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Christiaan

 2008/11/29 10:36Profile









 Re:


Why are many Christians so keen on "sending Solomon to heaven"? It's because they imagine that anyone who serves the Lord will definitely go to heaven. No matter how they live. Jesus said that many would come to Him on the last day and say, "Lord, we prophesied in Your Name, we cast out demons in Your Name, we did miracles in Your Name." But the Lord will say to them, "Depart from me, you who lived in sin." Solomon will come before the Lord in that day too and say, "Lord, I wrote three books of Scripture that blessed millions of people." And the Lord will tell him also exactly what He tells the others, "Depart from me, you who lived in sin." Let Solomon's life be a warning to all of us. Paul said, "I can preach to others, but be disqualified myself finally" (1Cor.9:27).



Not only is this false, but it is actually a proof of the reverse. What he actually is saying is because Solomon WASN'T serving the Lord in the best capacity he is going to hell.

If the Lord owns Solomon as a son, Solomon is a son indeed.

 2008/11/29 10:45









 Re:

An acknowledgment of Solomon as a writer of scripture must mean an agreement that the Lord is also referring to him in the verses below.

Luke 1:70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:

2 Peter 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

Acts 3:20-21 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.


God owns Solomon as a son, as His beloved, and will not take away His mercy from him. It is not possible to be 'more saved' than that.

2 Sam 7:14-15 I will be his father, and he shall be my son. If he commit iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the children of men: But my mercy shall not depart away from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I put away before thee.

Neh 13:26 Did not Solomon king of Israel sin by these things? yet among many nations was there no king like him, who was beloved of his God, and God made him king over all Israel: nevertheless even him did outlandish women cause to sin.

2 Sam 12:24 And David comforted Bath-sheba his wife, and went in unto her, and lay with her: and she bare a son, and he called his name Solomon: and the Lord loved him.


Solomon loved the Lord in return, albeit an imperfect love. How many of US love the Lord, yet wittingly or unwittingly offer sacrifice to false gods, whether they be jobs, or sports, or family etc? Let the first one who has a perfect love for the Lord stand up to condemn Solomon.

1 Kings 3:3 And Solomon loved the Lord, walking in the statutes of David his father: only he sacrificed and burnt incense in high places.


To which enemy of God hath the Lord appeared? I know of only one case where even the angel of the Lord appeared to an enemy, but even in Balaam's case, it was his donkey that saw first, and because he refused to listen to the donkey, the angel of the Lord appeared to Balaam for higher purposes than Balaam's good.

1 Kings 9:2 That the Lord appeared to Solomon the second time, as he had appeared unto him at Gibeon.


If Solomon died an enemy of God, like Judas, he was always an enemy, but merely put up a good front. The difference between Judas and Solomon is that Judas' character was made to appear impeccable until he disowned Christ, whereas Solomon's character was shown in all it's glory as well as its shame. This is another thing one looks for in a biblical saint. If we only reveal our glory to others, we ought to heed the warning to Judas, whereas if our shame is revealed as well, there is comfort in knowing that saints before us like Solomon and Samson, as well as David and Abraham, had shame of their own

It is imperative that we not err on either side of this verse, and learn to properly discern between the holy and the profane.

Prov 17:15 He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the Lord.

 2008/11/29 11:58
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4994
Sweden

 Re:

2Pe 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
2Pe 2:15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
2Pe 2:16 But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet.


Baalam was a prophet, he heard Gods voice. Is he also in heaven?

I think to assume Salomon is in hell is correct since he never repented, repentance is necessary for being saved. No person that has not repented will be in heaven. And since there are more then one book and not one of them says he repented.

And i see no worse thing assuming he is in heaven then assuming he is in hell. Because if we say he is just when clearly he was not at the end, he may started out so but its a tragic story.

so saying he is in heaven when he is not just is also then an abomination.

I think Salomon is an example of what can happened, and we need to take heed.

If you do not see it so i respect that.

But i think Zac Poonen writing about this is very accurate.


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CHRISTIAN

 2008/11/29 12:11Profile
HomeFree89
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Joined: 2007/1/21
Posts: 797
Indiana

 Re:

I think that arguing over whether or not Solomon is in heaven or hell is kind of beside the point in this thread. We can make our case, so to speak, in better ways. Why not stick with those things that are perfectly clear in Scripture?


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Jordan

 2008/11/29 12:25Profile
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4994
Sweden

 Re:

Quote:

HomeFree89 wrote:
Why not stick with those things that are perfectly clear in Scripture?



Good advice brother, ill take to heart.


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CHRISTIAN

 2008/11/29 12:33Profile





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