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Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : Not Under Bondage–Marriage, Divorce, and Remarriage -taylor

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ginnyrose
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Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7421
Mississippi

 Re: Not Under Bondage–Marriage, Divorce, and Remarriage -taylor

Quote:
In other words, He bases it on the fact that the marriage bond continues to exist despite the divorce. It is not the (sin of) divorce which makes remarriage impossible for the Christian; it is the (original) marriage



This is so true. Ask anyone about their marriage and inevitably if there was a divorce, they will tell you about it and if you listen closely to their tale, you can easily detect the bond that still exists there.

I was also struck with how our son-in-law was released from the bond he had with our daughter. She had died, leaving behind two children. He remarried and it was not long until I saw that bond he had with her was gone, absolutely gone. I do not know how often this happens, but he was now again in a God ordained marriage and he had work to do, like providing for this family and making this marriage work.

Oh, and how did I feel about that loss of bond with our daughter? He was good to her while she lived but she is now in a better place and while he still lives here, he needs to make a life for his children so he better get with it.

My thoughts...

ginnyrose


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2009/1/20 23:33Profile
hulsey
Moderator



Joined: 2006/7/5
Posts: 640
Missouri

 Re:

Here's something else to consider. A little furter in the 1Cor. passage it says this:

Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be released. Are you released from a wife? Do not seek a wife. But if you marry, you have not sinned;
1Cor.7:27-28a

The Greek word for released (loosed in the KJV) means divorced.


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SI Moderator - Jeremy Hulsey

 2009/1/21 2:42Profile
pastorfrin
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Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:

Quote:

hulsey wrote:
Here's something else to consider. A little furter in the 1Cor. passage it says this:

Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be released. Are you released from a wife? Do not seek a wife. But if you marry, you have not sinned;
1Cor.7:27-28a

The Greek word for released (loosed in the KJV) means divorced.




Hi hulsey,
This whole section goes together and is talking about virgins.

From the article posted,
Quote:

"To The Unmarried And Betrothed

In verse 25 Paul is clearly beginning a new section, making the statement, “Now concerning virgins.” As mentioned before in dealing with unequally yoked marriages, Paul tells them that he has no direct commandment from Jesus on this issue, “Now concerning virgins I have no commandment of the Lord: yet I give my judgment, as one that hath obtained mercy of the Lord to be faithful.” In this section, from verses 26-38, Paul is addressing what betrothal couples should do during the difficult times that they were experiencing. Paul had just made the argument that everyone should remain in the state in which they were called. He also lifted up the single life, even rivaling that of married life as respects devotion to God. Now, concerning “the present distress,” the natural question that had arisen in Corinth was what to do with couples that had established betrothals and arranged marriages already. In these verses Paul again lifts up the single life, but he makes it clear that these couples are not sinning if they go ahead and get married. This entire section reads very naturally as a discussion addressing these courting couples.

Modern Confusion

Some have ignored the indications that this is the beginning of a new section (Now concerning virgins) and have tried to turn the words, “Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned”, into a license to remarry. They again attempt to tie this passage back to the previous verses dealing with the “deserted”. They insist that Paul is still addressing the issue of the deserted spouse from the preceding section and thereby conclude that Paul is making yet another argument for remarriage. Some support this argument by saying that the word “wife” in this passage demands that this section refers to a married person. While this point might be substantiated in English language, it must be taken into consideration that the word “wife” in the Greek is simply the word “woman” and does not make a distinction. Furthermore, when considering the totality of the passage, pressing the word beyond this becomes a big stretch.

These are all unfortunate interpretations of this passage. A natural reading of the passage, coupled with Paul’s subject marker “now concerning virgins,” makes this whole argument pretty unlikely. With this in mind, verses 26-38 read very naturally from start to finish concerning the marriage of people involved in a betrothal or prearranged marriage. Do not forget, instructions as to what to do if a married person divorces had already been specifically and explicitly addressed back in verses 10-16. To say now that the divorcee is free to remarry would completely contradict all the instruction given back in the previous passage.

The Betrothed Couple

A small, but significant point worthy of mention here, is the wording “and if a virgin marry” from verse 28. Andrew Cornes brings out that in the Greek, Paul uses the definite article “he parthenos” which is properly translated “the virgin,” not “a virgin”. As the Young’s Literal Translation reads, “But and if thou mayest marry, thou didst not sin; and if the virgin may marry, she did not sin.” The way it is worded currently almost implies two completely separate subjects. This doesn’t necessarily change the section all that much, but the proper wording would make the flow even more clear. The discussion is clearly about the betrothed couple, not two different subjects.

Paul’s Final Word On The Marriage Bond

Concluding this whole section Paul, or rather the Holy Spirit through Paul, wanted to make sure that no one misunderstood this chapter. Once again he proclaimed his final dictum concerning the marriage bond and remarriage in very simple, clear and concise words: “The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.”

Interestingly, a very similar statement was made to the Romans when the topic being discussed had nothing to do with divorce and remarriage at all. In Romans, it came instead from a discussion about the Law. There, Paul said:

Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth? For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband. So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man (Romans 7:1-3).

Paul made some pretty strong statements here. He once again spoke in unmistaken clarity that the marriage bond was for life, and that only death made a person free to remarry. It would be hard to wiggle out of this statement and start looking for loopholes and exceptions. However, as clear as his words are, the Romans passage is usually quickly dismissed because the context under discussion here in Romans 7 is the use of the Law, not divorce and remarriage. For the most part, I would agree with this reasoning and dismiss the statement as well. However, the fact that Paul repeats almost the exact same thought over in I Corinthians makes it difficult for me to completely dismiss the Romans passage altogether. Whatever the case, there can be no doubt that in I Corinthians 7:39 Paul is specifically dealing with remarriage, and there he distinctly states that the marriage bond is for life and that only the death of a spouse makes a person free to remarry."

 2009/1/21 3:45Profile
Heydave
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Joined: 2008/4/12
Posts: 1306
Hampshire, UK

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 Re:

For those who want to be legalistic, consider this:

1 “When a man takes a wife and marries her, and it happens that she finds no favor in his eyes because he has found some uncleanness in her, and he writes her a certificate of divorce, puts it in her hand, and sends her out of his house, 2 when she has departed from his house, and goes and becomes another man’s wife, 3 if the latter husband detests her and writes her a certificate of divorce, puts it in her hand, and sends her out of his house, or if the latter husband dies who took her as his wife, 4 then her former husband who divorced her must not take her back to be his wife after she has been defiled; for that is an abomination before the LORD, and you shall not bring sin on the land which the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance.". (Dueteronomy 24 v 1-4).

It would seem that this is saying that anyone who has divorced and re-married CANNOT go back to their first husband or wife as it would be an ABOMINATION TO GOD. This includes if the second spouse dies or divorces the person.

So anyone encouraging people to divorce their second spouse and return to their first is encouraging them to comit an abomination.

And in my view anyone that has re-married should not divorce to remain single. God HATES divorce and to do this a second time to try and correct the first is just madness and TWICE grevious to the LORD.


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Dave

 2009/1/21 7:23Profile
murrcolr
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Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1529
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Here's my testimony.......

When I was a teenager my Mother. I wasn't a Christian, however my Mother was. One nigt she came into my bedroom and woke me up. I asked what was wrong. She said "God has spoken to me and that he wanted me to know something" I replied what was it he wanted me to know and she told me. (I will not tell you what was told me) After this she was about to leave and asked did God tell you anything else. She replied "You'll be married to a woman who was married and has two children".

Today I am married to that woman that I was told about when I was a teenager. I know it's God will for me to be married to her full stop.

When I read all these posts and debates all I can do is shake my head in unbelief at what I read. The God that I met is a God of Grace a God that forgives a sinner and makes him new creation.

Romans 8v1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

I know the God who waits for the adultress at the well, I know the God who sits with the tax collectors and the publicans. I know the God of Mercy.

But beware there are professing Christian people, who are determined to bring you under their religious thumb. They are bent on making you a slave of their conscience. They have built a tidy religious box, without biblical justification, and strive to stuff you inside and make you conform to its dimensions. They are legalists, and their tools are guilt, fear, intimidation, and self-righteousness. They proclaim God’s unconditional love for you, but insist on certain conditions before including you among the accepted, among the approved elite, among God’s favored few.

I’m talking about Christian legalists whose goal is to enforce conformity among other Christians in accordance with their personal preferences. These are life-style legalists. They threaten to rob you of joy and to squeeze the intimacy out of your relationship with Jesus. They may even lead you to doubt your salvation. They heap condemnation and contempt on your head so that your life is controlled and energized by fear rather than freedom and joy and delight in God.

Rarely would these folk ever admit to any of this. They don’t perceive or portray themselves as legalists. If they are reading this they are probably convinced I’m talking about someone else. They’d never introduce themselves: “Hi! My name is Joe/Julie. I’m a legalist and my goal is to steal your joy and keep you in bondage to my religious prejudices. Would you like to go to lunch after church today and let me tell you all the things you’re doing wrong?”

Jesus said in Mathews Gospel go and learn what this means "I desire mercy, and not sacrifice"

I have a question what will you do if the man who God chooses to lead the next move of god is married to a divorcee and her ex-husband is not dead?


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Colin Murray

 2009/1/21 8:37Profile
RobertW
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Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
Independence, Missouri

 Re:

As among those of us that have been through divorce and remarriage and are battle scarred from this topic here on Sermonindex may I offer a few cents worth of wisdom?

I have heard your arguments. I have likely read the passages more times than you have because [u]my[/u] soul and the people involved in my life's souls are also at stake. The glory of God is at risk. Selah.

With an open heart before God and with all these matters present in mind I have desired above all things to do [u]HIS[/u] will. I have been [i]there[/i] and I have been through situations that would probably stagger most peoples minds. I am speaking from deep and soul scarred experience. This is not theoretical or doctrinal- it is practical and existential.

Each person must be FULLY persuaded in his/her own mind about these matter. Just as there are those here that would disqualify from salvation any one divorced and remarried I also know those that would tell you:

1. If you do not speak in tongues you are not saved.
2. If you do not pay 100% of your tithe to God you are not saved.
3. If you watch TV you are not saved.
4. If you wear pants as a woman you are not saved.
5. If you were not baptized in the name of Jesus Christ you are not saved.
6. Etc. and etc.

How long will individuals that name the name of Christ set an naught their brothers and sisters and be the source of unbearable discouragement and un-edification? Away with your footnotes about sounding harsh, etc. It is evil and it is sinful and God is keeping a record. You will answer to God for being a stumbling block to anyone trying to come to Christ with a whole heart under difficult circumstances.

Where is the edification in all these things? This biting and devouring and consuming? Adulteress and adulterers under the Law were to be stoned to death. Shall we look to the Law for answers? Shall we look to Ezra for an answer? Shall we look to Malachi and say Christians are cursed for not paying title? What madness and nonsense? The extent to which I have watched people compromise their own integrity to prove unconditional matrimony has staggered me on more than one occasion. There is simply no changing their minds no matter what. They will dig through any resource they can find to prove their point. And all it does is bring discouragement and unedification to the people involved. That is all it has ever done.

So as reluctant as I am to even engage again in this battle; with scare on top of scar to prove my record, let me say that GOD is my judge and YOU are not. To my own Master I stand or fall and I have been holden up. God has made me to stand.

And yes I will answer to Him on that great day of judgment. And in the mean time I will try to ignore the constant badgering and friendly fire that has lead me into despair more than once. If you want to answer to God some day for having been the cause of my stumbling or some other precious soul for whom Christ died stumbling then just keep on with it. You have been warned. God will remind you of it.











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Robert Wurtz II

 2009/1/21 9:24Profile
Heydave
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Joined: 2008/4/12
Posts: 1306
Hampshire, UK

Online!
 Re:

And here's my testimony.....

My wife and I will have been married 21 years this year. We married as Christians when she was divorced with two young girls. I was a batchelor.

Her husband had commited adultery and left her for this woman and then married the woman and had another family. He has subsequently divorced that one and married again.

I knew what I was taking on with an instant family and we had many difficult times, being on the receiving end for the girls' hurts, being the 'step dad', etc. But we prayed and worked at it and did all we knew to bring them up right. We made many mistakes, but God is gracious. During their teenage years they rebelled against the LORD and us (they won't mind me saying this) and got into a mess. But we stuck with it and prayed and prayed... Now they are grown up and walking strongly with the LORD.They really love the LORD and seek to serve Him with all their hearts. One married (a Christian man) last year and the younger is getting married this March to a Christian man. Praise the LORD for His mercies endure forever!


We all meet together regularly (as we live near by) for bible study and supporting one another. I have a wonderful relationship with these girls and all the difficult years just make what we have now even more wonderful and fulfilling. God's grace is amazing!!


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Dave

 2009/1/21 9:55Profile
rbanks
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Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1257


 Re:

Thanks to all you brethren that have come on here with your testimonies.

I just now have come on here and read them and they have brought tears to mine eyes. I praise God for his grace in your lives.

I have had an almost perfect marriage to the same woman over 24 years, whom I love today more than ever, but God has saved me from being legalistic to those who haven't.

Some of the most spirit-filled God loving people I know have been through a divorce or remarriage.

Thanks again for your testimonies!

 2009/1/21 10:27Profile









 Re:

Quote:
1. If you do not speak in tongues you are not saved. 2. If you do not pay 100% of your tithe to God you are not saved. 3. If you watch TV you are not saved. 4. If you wear pants as a woman you are not saved. 5. If you were not baptized in the name of Jesus Christ you are not saved. 6. Etc. and etc.

Sounds like a set of more laws doesn't it?

I have observed that the people that do the most judging are those that are NOT married. And those that are married and have judged other marriages they themselves are divorced.

I think that when you use the word of God as a law against people and it doesn't matter if it's the Torah or Paul's writings, we are placing ourselves as judge over mans affairs and we do not know a mans heart let alone our own.

We should ask ourselves the question, are we to practise the law in regards to divorce and remarriage? If yes, then how can grace fit it into this?

If yes, what other Old Testament laws are we under?

Now we have to remember that if we obey the law in part, we are a debtor to the whole law.

We have to think like a mind that has been renewed by the grace of God to fully understand how to treat each case, otherwise we'll end up crucifying everyone that comes against our theology.

 2009/1/21 20:17
pastorfrin
Member



Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:

rbanks wrote:
Quote:
“Dear PastorFrin,

I am glad that you love the Lord and have been faithful to him. I appreciate your stand for the truth.

Just suppose though in your past before you got saved, you experince a divorce. Since this time you were saved, filled with the Holy Spirit and remarried to a good christian woman also blessed with wonderful children. Let's just say you had a calling on your life to do a work for the Lord. Now you join a fellowship with some people who really seem to love the Lord and they give you a study on divorce and remarrige. Now you love God and really want to do his will. Are you going to go home and tell your wife and children that you are going to have to divorce your wife whom you love and God has blessed with salvation also because this group said that you were living in adultery...because your first wife was still living. They also told you that nothing not even the blood of Jesus and his cross could free you from your past marriage.

Is this the kind of truth you believe...I sure do hope not. This kind of teaching only condemns people for their past sins and mistakes. I am for the truth but when you use truth to lead into error and teaches something not found in the true gospel then I'm against it wholeheatily. How can anyone with any spiritual understanding and compassion believe that teaching something that condemns christians because of their past sins (including marrriage/divorce)forgiven by God can be called promoting true revival is beyond anything I have ever heard in my life.

Blessings to you all!”



******************************************

Hi rbanks,

I have never in all these years of ministry encouraged anyone to get a divorce for any reason. I have spent years of ministry teaching couples not to divorce, so no, I would not tell anyone to divorce.

My dear wife and I have been married for close to fifty years. During our years of marriage there were reasons she could have divorced me and I her according to the standards that are being taught today.

Brother, may I ask you a few questions?
Do you know what it meant to live with a husband and father who was to busy trying to be a good shepherd to his sheep that he neglected his family?
My wife did and according to some of the teachings today she should have divorced me.

Do you know what it meant to live with a man who was suffering from PTSD, who was so overcome with his own ghost from the past that his family was left alone?
My wife did and according to some of the teachings today she should have divorced me.

How about living with a wife and mother of your seven children, five who were five and under and your wife was too tired to meet your needs?
I did and according to some of the teachings today, I should have divorced her.

I could go on and on with reasons for us to get divorced according to some of the teachings today. We have not because the love of Jesus Christ has made us one flesh.
One flesh cannot be separated except and only by death.
Christians who marry become one in Christ Jesus and you cannot separate oneness.

We have polluted the teachings of Jesus Christ and we now have pastors, elders, friends and family encouraging divorce among Christians and it must stop.

How many families have been broken because of these devilish liberal teachings on divorce?

Ministers must teach the truth as stated in Gods word and the only harm that it will cause is to the kingdom of satan. But oh, how sever will be the judgment, by His word, against those who have made it easy and in to many cases encouraged Christians to divorce.

In His Love
pastorfrin



 2009/1/21 21:32Profile





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