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crsschk
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Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Bless you man.

Sorry if I was a bit sharp earlier. We are a pretty loving bunch around here even with all the seriousness of the issues at hand.

Hope you stay encouraged in the Lord and listen to what He is saying to you. Oftentimes He will use others to do that through as I have found from many of the brethren here.
And I am so grateful for that.
Even if it's just to get me thinking or challenging my presuppositions, always learning.


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Mike Balog

 2004/4/11 0:11Profile
KeithLaMothe
Member



Joined: 2004/3/28
Posts: 354


 Re:

I go away a few hours for a revival meeting, and everything happens without me :)

I've engaged in a lot of forum communication across the years, and one of the most singularly wearying things about it is the almost ubiquitous presence of a negative and contentious spirit. It is very encouraging to see that such a spirit does not hold sway here. If exchanges similar to the above had occured practically anywhere else on the internet, we'd be in the middle of a flame war. The spiritual maturity here gives me cause to praise God.

Re: some with evangelistic calling, some with prophetic calling/gifting:

This is near my heart because I find myself oscillating between the two. I feel motivated to witness and to preach to the non-Christians, partly out of sheer duty. But I also feel called to minister to God's people in an exhortative capacity.

There's something of a middle ground, too: preaching to the unconverted who think they're Christian, and to the backslidden Christians (a much smaller group, as far as I can tell).

One of Chanin's comments was particularly interesting, about finding it easier to accept unbelievers (who have less knowledge) than morally inconsistent "Christians."

I find I'm too soft with non-Christians, in personal witnessing I'm so gentle and reasonable (I try to be, that is) that they probably aren't getting the idea that God is genuinely angry with them; there's also the problem of the conversation going down rabbit trails (biblical veracity is a common one) and me not getting control of it. Thankfully God has me working with a hellfire-and-brimstone Holiness preacher, so I don't think the sinners walk away misinformed.

On the other hand, I think I'm too hard on other Christians (real ones). I preached a sermon once on evangelism at the campus fellowship I attend, and I think I was bordering on speaking with a bitter spirit. Thankfully God kept me from going too far, and I think that bore some good fruit. People were challenged, but not offended. I actually should have pressed harder, but with more love. Then people might have been changed.

I'm not sure either of the two callings involve giftings, in my case. All I need for either is a basic understanding of Scripture (only possible by God's guidance and light) and the present state of the world, and God's general provision. The "prophetic" side is prophetic in the sense that it involves exhortation, but I think it's just a matter of God having drawn me near enough to Him that I have some rudimentary understanding of His heart, and can exhort and encourage my Brothers and Sisters accordingly. It stands to reason that anyone truly close to God could do that. Then again, human reason doesn't generally get anyone very far in spiritual matters.

It's past midnight, so I'd better cease my ramblings before they lose what little coherence they presently have.

God's grace be with you,
-Keith

 2004/4/11 0:12Profile
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 Re:

Quote:
quote "You cannot use that as a scapegoat to preach anything you wish from the bible and then say if people reject me so what! its God they are rejecting." If you preach the truth, and people reject the truth, they are rejecting you and your message because they have decided to reject the truth. If they rejected Jesus then I would expect that if I am like Jesus I will be rejected. The more you share in His labors, the more you share in His sorrows. Ravenhill - "How is it that the world couldn't get on with the holiest man that ever lived but it could get on with you and me?"


Brother Jesse, I'm sorry if I have been trying to disagree with much of what you have been saying in this thread. I am sure if we sit down we have probably [b]alot[/b] in common in terms of our spiritual believes and inspirations. I see you quoting Leonard Ravenhill a few times and he is basically one of my mentors. I first read his book 'Why Revival Tarries' then I watched his videos and that set me off trying to spread his genuine message of revival to body of Christ, and 2 years later [u]SermonIndex[/u] is born.

Ohh and just to clarify to your brother, when I said 'that you can't learn evangelism' and then later said we should go through acts to find out how evangelism practically works, doesn't contradict. When I read scriptures, I pray that God reveals heavenly wisdom and revelation and that the Holy Spirit would teach and guide me into all truth in the matter. Therefore its not reading as a textbook but grasping in [i]my spirit[/i] precious words of [b]life[/b]. So in a sense I don't learn and teach myself but rather 'catch' things from the spirit. [i]Not taught, but caught[/i], and hopefully confirmed in my spiritual walk.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/4/11 0:30Profile
lazarus
Member



Joined: 2004/4/9
Posts: 61
Connecticut

 Re:

yes Ravenhill is one of my mentors also. I first came accross your site because I was searching on the web for ravenhill sermons. I used to go to school in Texas in Garden Valley on Keith Greens old ministry site right next to Tyler and Van. I have had the honor of even seeing Ravenhills grave and even hearing his son preach. Actually the first time i heard ravenhill was in "Selah" the compilation and I assumed he was still alive, then the very next day I was at his grave. Oh how that touched my heart. To hear a man preach on eternity and the judgement seat, and then see his grave the next day!!! In about the past 2 months I have read "Why Revival Tarries" "Revival Gods Way", "Sodom had no Bible" "Meat for Men" and am almost finished with "Tried and Transfigured". Then I'll read his other two

I just had this thought.
I was in Oregon recently preaching at a church on the topic of our responcibility (evangelism) and our rejection ( often the result). I said "Will the World reject us? Yes. And what do I say? I say good. Yea I said it. Good. Why? Because that's what Jesus said. Matt 5:10-12"


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Jesse

 2004/4/11 0:37Profile
lazarus
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Joined: 2004/4/9
Posts: 61
Connecticut

 Re:

ps. sermonindex, don't worry about it. If you knew me better you would know that some how some way even when I absolutely try not to, I cause contravercy wherever I go. History has show that I seem to make my best friends by first getting in debates with them. Weird huh? Like my friend who invited me to oregon to preach, oh boy the debates we have had! As Christian as he is he said he's gotten to the point where he's wanted to hit me! And this kid is nicer then Santa Claus!


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Jesse

 2004/4/11 1:07Profile
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Quote:
ps. sermonindex, don't worry about it. If you knew me better you would know that some how some way even when I absolutely try not to, I cause contravercy wherever I go. History has show that I seem to make my best friends by first getting in debates with them. Weird huh?


So I guess because the level of controvesy has been so high so are going to be [b]really[/b] good friends then right? and the name is Greg if you didn't know :-P

Quote:
I have had the honor of even seeing Ravenhills grave and even hearing his son preach. Actually the first time i heard ravenhill was in "Selah" the compilation and I assumed he was still alive, then the very next day I was at his grave.


Thats awesome brother, which brother did you hear preach? There's some [url=http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=225]David Ravenhill[/url] sermons here on SermonIndex. Paul Ravenhill is a missionary in South America, I have never come across an audio sermon of him though.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/4/11 1:13Profile
crsschk
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Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Thanks Keith

What an encouargement!

Quote:
It's past midnight, so I'd better cease my ramblings before they lose what little coherence they presently have.



Funny, that's how I feel when I am wide awake! :-)


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Mike Balog

 2004/4/11 1:27Profile
lazarus
Member



Joined: 2004/4/9
Posts: 61
Connecticut

 Re:

I believe that I heard Paul Ravenhill speak actually.

Hey, I posted some thoughts of mine in the forum: The True Gospel and The False .

I would love to hear your guys thoughts on my thoughts, positive or negative.


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Jesse

 2004/4/11 1:41Profile
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"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

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Quote:
ps. sermonindex, don't worry about it. If you knew me better you would know that some how some way even when I absolutely try not to, I cause contravercy wherever I go. History has show that I seem to make my best friends by first getting in debates with them. Weird huh? Like my friend who invited me to oregon to preach, oh boy the debates we have had! As Christian as he is he said he's gotten to the point where he's wanted to hit me! And this kid is nicer then Santa Claus!


Actually brother I have been praying and thinking about this and I really don't feel peace about this at all. If you are so much into debates with other brothers then I would assume that a negative thing, we don't get anywhere as Christians by debating and having so much pride in our positions. The things you have said about yourself are amazing but it scares me with you having these deep experiences of God but then coming across to the brethren quite harshly and not really exhibiting the Spirit of Christ in your communication. If a brother has come to the point of 'wanting to hit you' then I would really prayerfully consider either there's something really wrong with him or with some parts of your spiritual walk. I am not claiming to be perfect but I really am trying my best to allow God's words and heart to come through me in these forums. I really feel these forums are a place to build up the body of Christ and to an amazing extent God has allowed them to be that.

I believe there is a healthy place to discuss and share scriptures and you could call that (debating). This is not a place to discuss positive and negatives and to show how they clash, but rather to encourage, strengthen with your words to others. Keith has picked up on this spirit in the forums that [b]it is[/b] different than other Christian forums on the web, this is the Lord's working.

I am open to allow God to mold and change me through other brothers and sisters sharing there experiences and the word. I pray and hope everyone else on these forums exhibit that same humbleness and teachableness. Who are we kidding? We know so little; allow God to bring you to that next level.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/4/11 17:15Profile
lazarus
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Joined: 2004/4/9
Posts: 61
Connecticut

 Re:

Well I never ever said it was a good thing. I "don't feel peace about this at all" either! If there is one thing I hate it is debates. I don't go around starting debates, but I always run into people (like I did here) who want to try to debate me.

Quote “If a brother has come to the point of 'wanting to hit you' then I would really prayerfully consider either there's something really wrong with him or with some parts of your spiritual walk”
In the new testament you can find scriptural examples of men of God being hit but never of a “Christ-like” man hitting someone.

“The things you have said about yourself are amazing but it scares me with you having these deep experiences of God but then coming across to the brethren quite harshly and not really exhibiting the Spirit of Christ in your communication.”
I wonder if Christ was considered harsh when He flipped over the tables infront of all the religious people in the temple. Do you think those whom Jesus called “Hypocrits” 20 something times in Matthew chapter 23 thought he was harsh?

Greg I keep getting the feeling that you are TRYING to be difficult with me. Or as you said “ have been trying to disagree with much of what you have been saying in this thread.” Can't you give me a break man? I'm not saying you have an argumentative spirit but dO you realy have to disagree with everything I say?

There are some Christians that apparently you will either love or hate. I have found that to be true of myself. People will either absolutely love me with all their hearts, or hate me with a perfect hatred. But as you can tell from this thread, I look for unity or atleast common ground between Christians.


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Jesse

 2004/4/11 19:54Profile





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