Shalom ... Some, I trust most, of you are familar with Promise Keepers and the founder Coach Bill McCartney. Coach has begun a new ministry thrust, "The Road to Jerusalem." The mission is to encourage gentile Believers in Jesus Christ to embrace the Messianic Jewish community. Events will be scheduled to celebrate "together-together" the Hebraic heritage of our faith. The breaking down of the walls of many years of ignorance, indifference and insensitivities toward the Messianic Jewish community is clearly a healing cry from our Father's Heart and Hand. Jew and Gentile will sing praises as one in Messiah. The first event is December 3, 2004 in Palm Springs, CA USA. You might want to visit this organization's web site at roadtojeruslem.org Love and Prayers, Rabbi Eukel
_________________The Joy of The LORD is our StrengthThen ADONAI said, 'Write down the vision clearly on tablets, so that even a runner can read it. For the vision is meant for its appointed time; it speaks of the end, and it does not lie.
I think Messianic Synagogue is another name for Jewish Church; please persuade me otherwise. (I mean it; I would like to be persuaded otherwise)
_________________SermonIndex.net Moderator - Robert Wurtz IIObedience is better esteemed with God than acquired knowledge, it is the most important lesson -fundamental to the gaining of all spiritual knowledge from God. (GW North)
I have won lots of debates that leaves me painfully empty because I realize that person has not been "won" through GOD's Spirit but laborious argumentaation of theological wannebes who made the choice of not earning advanced degrees - and then disrespect those who have.
I wonder in the theological confines of some, whether their obessing on definitions has any reality with what Believing Jews, many of who identify themselves as "Messianic Jews," must contend with.
_________________His/yoursRon Bwww.biblebase.com"Love perfecteth what it begins; Thy power doth save me from my sins; Thy grace upholdeth me. This life of trust, how glad, how sweet; My need and Thy great fulness meet, And I have all in Thee.Jean Sophia Pigott (1845-1882)
It is affording a people the 'means' by which to exercise their liberty in its fullest expression and reach the Jews who would never in a million years attend a Church.
I cannot believe that Paul would have created a Jewish Church in New York or anywhere else. That was what Peter was doing and it drew Paul's legitimate rebuke.
If a Messianic Congregation would not allow non-Jews to enter into their fellowship or if they somehow were compelling Gentiles to live as the Jews it would warrent a rebuke. This has not been my limited experience around Messianics.
Shalom ...Let us re-visit Scripture, particularly 1 Corinthians 10: 32, which may not faithfully be divorced from the context Rav Sha'ul is teaching about freedom, liberty and conscience ... Rav Sha'ul is, of course, responding to a series of questions the Beleivers in Corinth have raised (the Messianic congregation in Corinth, it should be clearly noted is comprised of both Jews and non-Jews who have come to faith in YESHUA under the discipling of Rav Sha'ul. Furthermore, make no mistake about it, the congregation's place of gathering, if not a private home, would be known ONLY as a synagogue, at least until after 135 A.D., then perhaps the more dominant in numbers both in leadership and adherents Greek-speaking Believers would have used the Greek word for "called out ones, " - from which we derive the English word, ecclesiastical - of a church or clergy). 1 Cor 8 begins a lenghty discussion about food - what freedom, liberty do we as Believers - especially Jewish Beleivers during this period of "go-make disciples", have. Rav Sha'ul as a Hebrew of Hebrews, a rabbinic scholar who advanced ahead of others before the senority system would have elevated him, is "perfectly" way, observant and submissive to the "kosher" teachings GOD first instructed through His leader Moshe in the First Covenant (not the "old" as if it were no longer applicable, or has currency - a distorted understanding that some here in this electronic community embrace, as if it were "replaced", i.e., done away with, when the New Covenant is canonized). Some here in this electronic community want to superimpose on Rav Sha'ul's teachings that 10:32 sets up three little boxes that determines from then on whether you are "Jew" "Gentile" or "church of GOD." If you "tick" the "wrong" box (don't tick the Jew or Gentile box, some might caution, because then you are somehow outside THE box).Let us look at what Rav Sha'ul is saying from the Complete Jewish Bible in 1 Cor 10:32,33 and 11:1 "Do not be an obstacle to anyone - not to Jews, not to Gentiles, and not to GOD's Messianic Community. Just as I try to please everyone in everything I do, not looking out for my own interests but for those of the many, so that they may be saved; try to imitate me, even as I myself try to imitate The Messiah."Is Rav' Sha'ul making a threefold division of humanity, as some here in this electronic community reason? No, clearly in the context of Rav Sha'ul's teaching beginning at chapter 8, he has NOT come up with a new strange teaching that classifies the then known world into three neat little boxes, Jews, non-Jews (Gentiles) and the Messianic Community (Jews and non-Jews who are Believers in YESHUA). Frankly, Rav Sha'ul's previous persecution of Believers before his Dammesk dialogue with YESHUA, The LORD, he understood his narrow world was Jews and those who blaspheme. That is it just two choices of a box to tick - strict observant Jew or "others" who shoulod be jailed, whipped and even stoned to death! Notice that the goyim, peoples of other nations, are in this stricist of observing Jews view of no consequence. As Robert of this electronic community has been pointing our for some time on this thread, the first question of the Jerusalem Council for Messianic Jewish Believers was whether the goyim, gentile, could be a part of the Kingdom of GOD. ADONAI helped kosher-keeping Kefa recogniz that what GOD has created is clean. Kefa's vision was about food. But then,of course, we now know as he comes to know later, that it was not about food specifically, but about the goyim, Gentiles, who are enfolded into the community of Believers by GOD's election as evidenced by the manifestation of RUACH haKODESH enveloping Cornelius' household, just as He did on the Day of Shavu'ot (Pentecost). No Jewish eye or ear would have missed the divine parallel of the day of Shavu'ot in which RUACH HaKODESH manifests His Presence as fire enabling the Jewish Believers to speak The Word as a light to the goyim (nations). The parallel to the giving of The Word 50 days after the Pesach on Mount Sinai with the manifestation of fire, trembling, shaking would not have been missed by the Jewish eye and ear who had been given the grace to have the trust/faith to see and hear GOD's Heart and Hand. The fullness of understanding, to be sure, would take place later and be revisited in the open dialogue between Kefa and Rav Shau'l (on this point I was particularly blessed with the careful insight of both our Brothers Ron and Robert here in this electronic community as they pictured the dialogue dramatically. Ron's pastoral insight reaches a zenith I had not seen before in his writing).I have engaged in more side-bars than initially intended. Forgive me if you feel submerged in all this laboring of words. Let me state the point, as does David H. Stern, Ph.D, in his semianl work, "Jewish New Testament Commentary." Salvation does not wipe out identity as a Jew or a Gentile. Careful observation of Rav Sha'ul's other writings makes it clear he refers to saved Gentiles as simple "Gentiles" (Ro 11:13; Eph 2:11) and to saved Jews as "Jews" (Gal 2:13). He still referenced himself as a Pharisee (Act 23:6) which obviously has no meaning to a first century hearer except within the Jewish community. GOD's Kingdom, therefore consists of saved Jews who remain Jews and saved Gentiles who remain Gentiles. The Israelite community from Avraham and Moshe, you will recall, also had "foreigners" among them who were fully grafted into the cultured Olive Tree (would you deny the harlot Rahav's place in the ancestoral lineage of King David and The Messiah)! Love and Prayers, Rabbi Eukel
1. Withdrawing - hupostellō: to draw back, let down, lower
Br Robert wrote:
I agree with this to an extent, but would like to suggest that the primary thing that we are called out of is this world system. For the sake of those who don't already know let me backtrack and say; The Greek word for Church is ekklesia, which essentially means "called out".
_________________Jer 15:16 Your words were found, and I ate them, And Your word was to me the joy and rejoicing of my heart; For I am called by Your name, O LORD God of hosts.
