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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Healing

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lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re: Healing

Krispy, you seem to pick a fight when no one is fighting.

Quote:
PS This should boost my popularity...



(This shows that you know what your doing)

Then Krispy, you go off and say that WOF must believe in 'continual' healing till the 2nd coming of Christ. Which is totally out of line. *(I'm not defending WOF, just stating Krispy error in his judgement)*

Quote:
Why does everyone die eventually? If healing is for all, and God desires to heal everyone... why isnt there anyone thats 2,000 years old? In all that time there wasnt one person who had enough faith?



Also, I believe that Krispy you misunderstand what the orginal poster said.

You said.
Quote:
God does heal, no doubt. But not in the manner that you are espousing. This WOF doctrine is to be rejected and denounced.



Someone is asking God to heal someone. Is that WOF? No, brother. You said it yourself.

Quote:
God does heal, no doubt.



Then.

Quote:
Funny that Paul was [b]never[/b] healed.



Just because it doesn't say that 'Paul wasn't healed' in this situation, it doesn't mean that he NEVER was.

There ARE events that happened OUTSIDE of Scripture. (Ref. John 21:24-25)

But, about referring to Paul. Why would God heal Paul when God wanted to use this situation to HUMBLE Paul? He wouldn't because we all need to learn lessons (that's what a disciple is..) (Ref. 2 Corin. 12:7) *(If you didn't catch the 'lesson' God wanted to humble Paul through this 'thorn')*

Now, Ben Williams saying the greek says 'many and not all'. Hmm, I beg to differ.

In Mark 1:32. Here is the greek word for 'all'.[url=http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/words.pl?book=Mar&chapter=1&verse=32&strongs=3956&page=]here[/url]
Then in the following verses it describes what that 'all' intailed. "Many exocisms, many infirmaties lifted, etc". So, Many exorcisms + many healings of diseases = ALL healed from the city.

I had to look this up because I never heard anyone say what you said Ben, but maybe your looking up a different verse. Feel free to share maybe the one your talking about.

Now again about Paul. Theologians from every background disagree with each other on weither it was a sickness or the persecution that he was receiving or a demon.

Haha. Then 'hmmhmm' switches the greek about Mark Ch.1.

Now, since there is a lot of confusion referring to these verses. Here is the KJV.

Mark 1:32-35

32 And at even, when the sun did set, they brought unto him [b]all[/b] that were diseased, and them that were possessed with devils.

33 And [b]all[/b] the city was gathered together at the door.

34 And he healed [u]many[/u] that were sick of divers diseases, and cast out [u]many[/u] devils; and suffered not the devils to speak, because they knew him.

35 And in the morning, rising up a great while before day, he went out, and departed into a solitary place, and there prayed.

Here is my commentary again.

In Mark 1:32. Here is the greek word for 'all'.[url=http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/words.pl?book=Mar&chapter=1&verse=32&strongs=3956&page=]here[/url]
Then in the following verses it describes what that 'all' intailed. "Many exocisms, many infirmaties lifted, etc". So, Many exorcisms + many healings of diseases = ALL healed from the city.


Finally, to avoid any confusion on people reading my post. My point of posting this was to point out Krisipy's quick judgement; that was in error. (Not defending WOF) Then state Paul's problem was really a lesson of humilty. And finally, the greek does state ALL then describes what that "all" entailed.

Oh, Krispy probly already knows this. But I love that guy. (Maybe he didn't but now he knows) He has been a blessing to SI and to me personally. Helping me to maintain that 'balance'. Because their are a lot of wolves out there. This is just simply one area, where I think Krispy, 'jumped the gun' on his 'discerning' and felt the need to point it out.

**I'm not blameless by far. And Krispy if there is something that I missed, due share.

Now, before I finish my post. Why is someone's forum name 'Goddamus' or 'God-dam-us' that sounds quite rude and non-biblical.

 2007/2/21 15:31Profile
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991
Sweden

 Re:

i just don't get the "logic" in this,

for example...if my mother is sick, she is a Christian, she prays to God for healing, i pray for her for healing, then she dies, then it was my or her fault that she died because mine / her faith was to weak? and i got my faith from God , so we could blame God for my mothers death then? or what are people saying?

because we do get our faith from god, if you work up your own faith it ain't worth much, so if i get my faith from God and i pray for someone and they die , and let me clarify when i pray i do believe God will do it, if i don't believe it it is not prayer...i don't know what we call that but its not prayer, so if someone dies its Gods fault? or is it my fault because god didn't give me the faith i needed?

and people say he bore our sickness on the cross... he did,,,but also our sins... my head goes then to if we don't have faith that heals everyone everywhere...if not even my deceases are on the cross...how do you know your sins are? unless of course you don't sin anymore and dont get sick? i guess that is possible..... i don't know...i just have a hard time figure this out.... and what about Job? didn't Jesus allow him to get sick?

can someone explain this idea that no one should be sick if they just have faith.... witch Gods seems to hold back on... and if it is so...why isn't it also so whit our sins which he also bore on the cross?


_________________
CHRISTIAN

 2007/2/21 15:51Profile
Provost
Member



Joined: 2006/12/28
Posts: 117


 Re:

Difference in unbelief
The unbelief that hinders our sins to be carried is a rebelious, defiant unbelief
Sickness a doubt not rebelious defiance, but a doubt.
Now I am not saying there is a cut a dry way to get healed or do I know why believers have sickness (I believe God is a healer noone will ever tell me differently and I have diabetes) but there's the logic difference in sin and sickness

 2007/2/21 16:02Profile
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991
Sweden

 Re:

i think this is a wonderful article so i share it whit you all

Sickness, disease, decay, and death

(J. C. Ryle, "Christ in the Sick Room")

"Lord, the one You love is sick!" John 11:3

Sickness, disease, decay, and death are the
common lot of all mankind without exception.

The human body is a most frail and complicated
machine. From the sole of the foot to the crown
of the head, there is not a part of us which is not
liable to disease. When I think of the variety of
ailments which may assail our bodies, I do not
wonder so much that we die at last--as I do that
we live so long.

But whence comes this liability to sickness,
disease, and death?

The fall of man at the beginning has brought
sin into the world, and sin has brought with
it the curse of sickness, suffering, and pain.

God sends sickness in order to do us good. It is
a friendly letter from heaven. It is a knock at the
door of conscience. Happy is he who opens the
letter and reads it, who hears the knock and opens
the door, who welcomes Christ to the sick room.

Regard your sickness as . . .
a blessing in disguise,
a good and not an evil,
a friend and not an enemy.


_________________
CHRISTIAN

 2007/2/21 16:16Profile
Provost
Member



Joined: 2006/12/28
Posts: 117


 Re:

I think that stinks

Yes God sends sickness for our good. Not once though is the recepient happy about it. Sickness is only sent (by God not due to fact that we are fallen 2 seperate sicknesses) upon the defiant...not to the one following Christ diligently. Note the OT...Jews were sent plagues and sickness only when following other gods

 2007/2/21 16:30Profile
hmmhmm
Member



Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991
Sweden

 Re:

id like to recommend also a series of sermons by Zac Poonen, its called balance of truth...its in both video and audio, it is a blessing


_________________
CHRISTIAN

 2007/2/21 16:41Profile









 Re:

[b]LOVEGRACE...[/b]

First off, I should have made myself clearer who it was that I was responding to. You assume I was responding to the original poster, and part of the time I was. However, I was responding to Ben in most everything I said. I know it wasn't clear who I was responding to... sorry about that.

Secondly, I used to be deeply involved in WOF, and I know what they teach. They teach that we are the King's Kids... and as such, we should expect favor in this world, material blessings, and health. We should be able to speak to our illness (colds, flu, cancer etc) and expect them to be healed. In the entire time I was in WOF, not once had I heard anyone teach anything other than "God [b]will[/b] heal you if you believe He can."... or "speak to this illness and it [b]has[/b] to go, as long as you have faith". And I always wondered about these teachings when people died in the church. But no one ever addressed it at a funeral. Instead, they have celebration services to celebrate them entering heaven's gates.

And I would sit there and think... "yea, but they died! Their illness that y'all said was supposed to flea killed them. Where was their faith?"

So again, I ask... if God's will is for believers to live in perfect health... then why are there not any believers who are 2,000 years old?

This WOF is garbage, unscriptural and heretical.

Krispy

 2007/2/21 16:45
Almond
Member



Joined: 2005/4/6
Posts: 13


 Re:

This is what I believe however I could be wrong the faith of the person being prayed for must be an equivalent to the person who is praying. The majoring of the time when we are praying, we are praying the Word of God and by doing so, Faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God.

If a person is not yet healed, it’s because they choose to doubt. A double minded man should not think that he will receive anything from the Lord.

A double minded man or women should not think he or she will receive anything from the Lord.

Bottom line IS faith is a verb without faith it is impossible to please God, if you have faith the size of a mustard seed, you can tell this mountain to move and it will obey, when two or more agree on anything as touching it it shall be done.

This could be controversial, someone mentioned that Katherine Kulman died of cancer, yet she had a healing ministry, passed her mantle over to Benny Henn, and he then suffered of a heart condition for many years. Sure he is well known as an Evangelist, an Evangelist with a heart condition performing miracles by healing the sick.

It was during his healing ministry praying for someone to be healed of a heart condition, that it so happens it was the same heart condition that he suffered and God healed them Both.

Is there anything too hard for the Lord, God can do exceedingly and abundantly all that we ask or even think/hope for.

 2007/2/21 17:56Profile
lovegrace
Member



Joined: 2006/8/12
Posts: 313


 Re:

Krispy, I know you were apart of that disgusting doctrinal belief.

Thanks for clarifying everything. But keep in mind, you shouldn't 'vent' your anger at people because of a wrong doctrine. (This is something recent, like a week ago, the Lord has been teaching me)

 2007/2/21 18:02Profile
pastorfrin
Member



Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:Healing

Brothers and Sisters,
We all like to proclaim what we think or what we believe and what so and so said, but what does the Word say.
Mark 16:14-18
Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen. [15] And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. [16] He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. [17] And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; [18] They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
Notice, the words of our Lord. These signs SHALL
follow them that believe. When is the church going to stop making excuses for its unbelief?

Lord I believe, help thou my unbelief

pastorfrin

 2007/2/21 19:26Profile





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