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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Opposition From Everyone

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Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


It seem like you are trying to take a shower so you may be cleane enough to take a bath.

In other words: you think you need to clean up your life or be good enough before you could be saved.

The truth is, you need to come as you are, sins and all.
Unrepentant and stuborn as you are, HE will take you.

Meet Him at the cross and He will do all that needs to be done in you!

 2006/6/16 21:30Profile

Joined: 2006/6/15
Posts: 343
VCU @ Richmond, VA


Yeah... today didn't work out very well... I took back stolen merchandise... they asked me if I knew they could press charges... I said yeah... Then after it all, the manager offered me a job there, heh (weird turn of events).

But the thing is... while doing this, I felt 'horizontal repentance.' I felt wrong towards fellow man, but towards God, there was none, except 'sorry God'

Yeah... today was a failure... I was a fool to think that this was what was holding me back...

On the hour drive back to Richmond, was just feeling desperate... I'm growing quite weary of this... I've been struggling for months... I just want to give up... But why does my selfish pride keep going on like the Energizer Bunny™ ?

My ex-girlfriend asked me why I was making it so difficult. I said I don't know... I keep thinking God is here, or God is there... I run there... And God isn't there... Reminds me of Elijah in the side of the mountain... great wind, earthquake, fire... but God is in the silence... sigh, if I could only understand this...

I also felt as if Satan had such a strong grip on my life... he just doesn't wanna let me go. I begged God to take me from Satan's grasp... I wanna come to God as the prodigal son... But I can't...

Sam Yoon

 2006/6/17 0:57Profile

Joined: 2006/6/15
Posts: 343
VCU @ Richmond, VA


And thanks guys... again...

Sam Yoon

 2006/6/17 1:02Profile

 Re: Opposition From Everyone

I have a verse for you, Sam, which gives a context to what you were doing when you took back that merchandise. Maybe it's [i]verses[/i]....

(New King James Version) Matthew 3

13 Then Jesus came from Galilee to John at the Jordan to be baptized by him.

14 And John [tried to] prevent Him, saying, "I need to be baptized by You, and are You coming to me?"

15 But Jesus answered and said to him, "Permit [it to be so] now, for thus [b]it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness[/b]." Then he allowed Him.

16 When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him.

17 And suddenly a voice [came] from heaven, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."

By taking back the goods, you are doing what is right. This pleases God immediately. You don't need to expect a fanfare, but I believe a peace will settle on your soul, the more you walk this path of turning away from sin, and bringing forth fruit which shows you are repentant in the practical ways you have sinned. Interesting that John's baptism was all about this.

God looks forward to the day when He can also say (v 17) [color=0000FF]"This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased." [/color]

You are co-operating with Him now, and whether you [i]feel[/i] His pleasure or not, He is pleased that you are making straight paths for your feet [i]and walking in them[/i].

Hebrews 12
11 Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful; nevertheless, afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.

12 [b]Therefore[/b] strengthen the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees,

13 [b]and[/b] make straight paths for your feet, [b]so that[/b] what is lame may not be [dislocated,] but rather be healed.

14 Pursue peace with all [people,] and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord:

I think Mr Young's translation offers a little more definition to these familiar words from Hebrews:

12 Wherefore, the hanging-down hands and the loosened knees set ye up;

13 and straight paths make for your feet, that that which is lame may not be turned aside, but rather be healed;

14 peace pursue with all, [b]and the separation[/b], apart from which no one shall see the Lord,

15 [b]looking diligently over lest any one be failing of the grace of God[/b],

I like the use of the continuous tense in verse 15, because it offers [i][b]hope[/b][/i] in two ways..... that God's grace is coming towards us continuously, and that we can [u]stop[/u] [i][b]failing[/i][/b] to receive it.

This is a (typical of Young) much kinder and less austere rendering, than the KJV?NKJV

15 looking carefully lest anyone fall short of the grace of God;

which uses the word 'care' rather than 'diligent' and by choosing 'fall short', implies that it's already all over.... that's it [i]you've failed[/i]. This plays into the enemy's hands, and almost suggests to us there is something we can [i][b]do[/i][/b] to [i]stop[/i] falling short of the grace of God...... when in fact, all we have to 'do' is start receiving it again, (or for the first time).... and move on, this time [i][b]in[/i][/b] the grace of God and [u]with[/u] [i]Him[/i].

 2006/6/17 5:50

 Re: Oppostion from Everyone

Sam, you're going in the right direction..... I think, probably a pastor's son has had plenty of unnoticed anguish, (apart from the specific matter you mentioned), and maybe it this is a useful time to begin to take stock of what it cost you to grow up in a family where your needs were not always your father's most pressing priority.

Diane said:

So, now, I ask, who in your life do you need to let off the “hook”. Who are you angry at? Can you forgive all those who harmed you in the past, including your father, and the church in general? Are you prepared to walk into their lives with mercy, patience, and gentleness?

She raises very valid issues here, but truly appropriating the answers she suggests, only can bring growth to soul (your soul) over whatever period of time it takes for you to think through her big questions.

I think she has rolled many months of mature Christian processing into her last sentence and the paragraph following it, (which I did not quote from p2). This is not to say that forgiveness is not the key. However, unless you know [i]how[/i] angry you are and why, true forgiveness is not readily accessible.

I feel that part of your sense of deadness, is in fact, [i]numbness[/i], and while you may not need to 'feel' all the pain which that numbness is concealing - which is God's grace to you, to enable you to pull through - it does need to be acknowledged, by you, and you should begin to understand what it means. This is where anger comes in, although you may feel completely unemotional at the moment.... [i]Then[/i], when you get a perspective on why some numbness was good for you, you have something to pray into, knowing that the Lord is able to restore your losses and renew to you the health of your inner man. This may be a process, but you are at a good age to start to lay a sounder foundation for your future human relationships.

Returning to the matter of forgiveness.... this is a separate issue from healing. Healing is how God puts right the effects of things over which you have had [u]no[/u] control - the effects of living through your circumstances, and even direct aggression (against your best interest by other people), which was hostile to your inner health.

Seeking God for forgiveness for your own sin and sins, is [u]entirely your call[/u], but, if you have been taught that being forgiven will heal you of [i]everything[/i], then [u]that[/u] [b]is untrue[/b]. It will heal you from the effects of sin you chose to do, and sinfulness, [b]but not from sins others committed [i]against[/i] you[/b]. For those, you need healing with no strings attached........ You don't have to apologise to God for being hurt, or sick at heart, or disappointed, or tired of trying. Your pride doesn't come into this either..... or shouldn't do.

All the gospel writers record healings, and in every case, sin was not an issue which Jesus raised with the sick person before He healed them. His compassion for their condition was [b]unconditional [i]to them[/i][/b] at the point of their need, (although we know it is by [i]His stripes[/i] [b]we are healed[/b]).

 2006/6/17 6:30

Joined: 2006/6/17
Posts: 45
Guolburn, NSW Australia

 Re: Opposition From Everyone

Hi Sam
I'm a newbie too!
I agree as posted before that God is obviously working on you, otherwise you wouldn't be bearing your soul in this forum, you'd be off trying to enjoy your sin.
What you seem to talking about sounds very similar to my fathers testimony.
He was brought up in the church and went through many religious phases and he even started preaching at youth camps (where many people were getting saved and are still walking strong with the Lord). But it was at one of these camps that the Lord spoke to him very strongly telling him that he wasn't saved. At first he rebuked it thinking it was a lie from the enemy, but as he begun to pray and read he knew it was the Lord speaking to him. anyway.. He shared it with his pastor, and began to get up at 5 every morning and pray with his pastor until he REALLY MET with Jesus. This period lasted for SEVERAL MONTHS, in which time the Lord sovereignly brought back sins from the past, which my father began to put right where it was at all possible (that meant tracking down people from primary school that he had bullied and similar).
It was not until several months later that he got "saved". He pinpoints his salvation over three days at these 5 oçlock prayer meetings with his pastor, in which he conciously and specifically offered his WHOLE life to the Lord. Ie. His health, wealth, family, Job etc.
He was a property developer, but after this the Lord called him to "full time minstry" and he said it was not a struggle at all because he had already layed his life down.
Many people have speculated that he was already "saved" in his early days but he says "I know now what it is like to be born again now and I can tell you that I was not born again before"
I don't intend to convey any doctrine, many of the wonderful people in this forum have already done a brilliant job, this is just a real life story of which I can testify that if you seek the Lord with all your heart you WILL find him!

I hope this can be of some encouragment. Keep Seeking.

 2006/6/17 7:24Profile

Joined: 2006/6/15
Posts: 343
VCU @ Richmond, VA


I believe Christ wants me to deem the sacrifice... to actually acknowledge what rags and what filth I am trading for eternal life...

I've been saying Christ... save me... "Save you from what ?" My sins God... "What sins?" All of them... "I don't think you're willing to give it all up, you haven't counted the cost."

I must deem the sacrifice... how much of my life is God taking away... all of it... yeah... I haven't come to full realization of what this statement means.

Sam Yoon

 2006/6/17 10:08Profile

Joined: 2004/4/5
Posts: 952


Just as I am
Without one plea.
But that Thy Blood was shed for me.
And since Thou bidst me come to Thee
O Lamb of God, I come.
I come.

There's room at the Cross for you
There's room at the Cross for you.
Tho millions have come
There's still room for one.
Yes, there's room at the Cross for you.

Jesus is bidding you to come.
He will clean you up, through the Power of the Holy Spirit.
May He be real to you, today.

God Bless you

 2006/6/17 10:15Profile

Joined: 2006/6/17
Posts: 2

 Re: Opposition From Everyone

I'm a little late to all this, yes I know - but:
I just sat here for the past 20-25 minutes reading your entire thread...
And I just wanted to say that it made me want to cry...for all the frustration you're going through, and the false hopes, and etc.
I truly, truly, hope that you repent and desire to glorify God regardless of where you end up: Heaven or Hell.
I'm not going to offer advice or point you in a direction or give you Bible verses to read; I don't want to give you some prepaved path to salvation, like you said in one of your earlier posts...
Thank you for your honesty; it's...touching.

 2006/6/17 11:35Profile

Joined: 2005/10/18
Posts: 490



I pray that you count the cost of following Jesus. It literally will cost you everything. The Holy Spirit has asked me time after time "Ed what does it cost to follow me?" and I've answered Lord it will cost me everything (all of my time, my energy, money, hopes, dreams, etc.). The cost is very clear. You can't have Jesus and the world too, it simply doesn't work that way. It literally has cost me everything to follow Jesus and it will be no different for you Sam.

When that same question comes up in the prayer closet now I have such joy in my heart and I can understand what Paul said in Philippians 3:7-9 "7But whatever was to my profit I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. 8What is more, I consider everything a loss compared to the surpassing greatness of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them rubbish, that I may gain Christ 9and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God and is by faith."

Everything he has taken from me has simply been rubbish. The King James Version uses the word dung, which appears to be a bit more accurate. Oh what a joy to give everything to Jesus. I pray that you make this same choice so you can agree with Brother Paul and me that everything in this life is dung and discover for yourself what a joy it is to gain Christ and have his righteousness imparted to you. What glory it is to be follower of Christ.

Blessings to you Sam. I praise God for your honesty. God never plays games Sam, so know He is very serious.

Ed Pugh

 2006/6/17 15:13Profile

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