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ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Hi Ironman,

Quote:
perhaps in reading the scriptures we've assumed the love we had in ourselves was sufficient or that this was the love which was spoken of?



It sure is easy to rely upon our own love - it just can't support the weight of our walk before God in this evil world, you know?

My own experience has been that when the love I have for others and my fellow man is actually [b]tried[/b] by the fires of hostility, or dishonesty, or some wrong done, or when the cost begins to rise above the convience of [b]my own[/b] tolerance for discomfort or heaviness or temptation, or some pre-arranged tidy thought of generosity or compassion, [b]then[/b] the true weight and worth and depth of my love is [b]exposed[/b]. It doesn't go very deep.

Maybe if we could meditate upon a verse that speaks to the measure - that length and width and depth and height of our God's love, it would be this one..?


Quote:
..consider him that endured such contradiction of sinners against himself



Yet, isn't this available to us also?

Quote:
And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it:



in the recent film The Gospel of John, the translation in the movie says it similar to this:

"I have revealed You unto them, and will continue to reveal You"

but for what puprose...

Quote:
that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.



It sounds like the Lord is saying that the [b]same[/b] love with which the Father loves the Son can be in us! Would this not mean, but not only, that we would be assured of God's love for us....?

before this the Lord says

Quote:
for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.



Ohh brother, what could we not bear if our hearts were so assured? How charitable would we not be if so vast a treasure, the eternal unfailing love of the Father, as unchanging as the Immutable God Himself, were laid up in our bossom and spilling out for want of room to contain it!? Would we not view the richest man as poor, the wisest as fool, the meanest as pleading the Father's compassion, the hurting as inviting His living waters to flow?

Brother, I am needy for sure.


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2006/6/9 21:37Profile
Tears_of_joy
Member



Joined: 2003/10/30
Posts: 1554


 Re:

Oh this article made me sad...I had no plans to post more on this thread, but this article made me so..

Quote:
DOING CULTURAL AND POLITICAL BATTLE WITH THE ENEMIES OF GOD.



Cultural and political battle!? :-o

[i]For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
-Eph.6

3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds
-2 Cor. 10[/i]

Quote:
It is the APPLIED FORCE FOR GOOD AGAINST WHICH THE GATES OF HELL CANNOT PREVAIL.



There is no such thing in the bible.

Quote:
Masculine Christianity is the engine of revival: prophetic, expansionist, uncompromising.




Quote:
In Biblical history, the greatest heroes of the faith exemplified masculine Christianity. Abraham did not sit idly by when his brother Lot was captured by the four kings. [b]He armed his servants and went out to rescue him by force.[/b] Moses faced down Pharoah in a series of [b]aggressive confrontations[/b]. David fearlessly challenged and defeated Goliath and then [b]cut off his head[/b] as a trophy of battle



I can not find Jesus to teach us to "get armed our servants and to went to rescue something by force", "cut of someone's head".

But rather:
[i]1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.
2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
3 [b]And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.[/b]
4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, [b]but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:[/b]
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, [b]but in the power of God.[/b]
-2 Cor.2 chapter[/i]

Oh, thank God that when we are weak, the power of God can flow through us. And only then! Because we and our force have misirable failed. And we are doing just bad to His kingdom.

[i]26 For ye see your calling, brethren, [b]how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:[/b]
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and [b]God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;[/b]
28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.[/i]

Praise God for that!

Quote:
John the
Baptist, who boldly and publicly rebuked Herod for his sexual immorality was praised by Jesus Himself.



John is taken as a only New Testament example of masculinity. But let us see where does his power come from:
[i]20 For Herod feared John, knowing that he was a [b]just man and an holy[/b], and observed him; and when he heard him, he did many things, and heard him gladly.
-Mark 6[/i]

John was a holy man and that's why Herod feared him.


Quote:
The period of the AMERICAN REVOLUTION is one in which deeply religious men took up the sword to overthrow an unrighteous oppressor.



The author has epxressed himself very well, maybe they were "deeply religious men". There are many religious men even today.

[i]52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: [b]for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
-Mat.26[/i][/b]


Quote:
The church and this nation cry out for a revival of masculine Christianity,



I would rather agree with Duncan Campbell when he said:

[b]A baptism of holiness, a demonstration of godly living is the crying need of our day.[/b]

God bless you.

 2006/6/9 22:04Profile
Logic
Member



Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

Stever wrote:

Quote:
What is missing here? What are we all about? Do we "Spiritualize" everything in order not to face evil, head to head like Abraham, David, and all the others? We are NOT Jesus Christ, we are men of flesh and blood that have a job to do. The job cannot be done while sitting on the couch, or sitting at our computers fantasizing that we are Jesus Christ, or that we are even like Him. He sees us that way because we have the down payment, the Holy Ghost that lives in our hearts, but we are still not like Him. We have Adams flesh and Adams blood in our veins. We will not be like Him until the rapture. In the meantime, let's all get to work!


But we are in Christ as He is in the Father.

[b]Ephesians 1:20, 2:1,5-6[/b] [color=990000]Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,
[b]2:1[/b] And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
[b]:5[/b] Even when we were dead in sins, [b]hath quickened us together with Christ,[/b] (by grace ye are saved;)
[b]:6[/b] [u]And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus[/u]:[/color]
[b]Colosians 3:3[/b] [color=990000]For ye are dead, and [b]your life is hid with Christ in God.[/b][/color]

Our place is on our knees and in fellowship with ministry.

Let the politicians do their own work and and let us not becoming entangled in the affairs of this world and this life.

Quote:
Too many (though by no means all) of today’s pastors,deacons and elders shrink timidly from the challenge of the world, more interested in decorating the interior of their church buildings THAN IN DOING CULTURAL AND POLITICAL BATTLE WITH THE ENEMIES OF GOD.
......Instead, this is vigorous rebuke to both women and men within the church who reject the
masculine side of Christianity and have thus abandoned those outside our “church families” to fend for themselves against the forces of evil in the world.


[b]2Corinth. 10:3-5[/b] [color=990000]For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
[b]:4[/b] (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)
[b]:5[/b] Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;[/color]

[b]Ephesians 6:12[/b] [color=990000]For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.[/color]

 2006/6/10 0:23Profile
IRONMAN
Member



Joined: 2004/6/15
Posts: 1924
IN HEAVENLY PLACES WITH JESUS

 Re:

bro Stever
a most interesting article indeed. if i remember well, Jesus did upturn the tables of the moneychangers because they were defiling the temple. Jesus also didn't hit back when they beat Him before His crucifixion, and He told us to turn the other cheek...now i'm not saying that nations don't have a provision in scripture to defend themselves, but i am calling for us to more closely examine ourselves in light of the Love of God. were it not for His grace you could have been like Zarqawi, i could have been him, anyone could have.

you said this:

Quote:
In conclusion, this thread started off as a celebration for an enemy of the Cross, and an enemy of America being killed while involved in a war--a war that he was involved in that amounted to beheadings, murder, rape, car bombs, people bombs, kidnap and ransom, and mayhem. How did that celebration end up as a treatise on Christ's love.



how can we celebrate the death of a sinner (who could have been any one of us save for God's grace) when God doesn't? i think it's dead wrong to celebrate such when the Lord doesn't, i mean how rebellious is that? of course the things this man did grieved God and many others, but let us not forget the many things which we do that grieve God. it's easy to point out sin out there but by far a much harder thing to look for, identify and deal with when sin is within. This is a BIG problem which we must all tackle. it's easy to love eachother as Christians but we're also called to love our enemies...man Jesus Christ left a tall order, but the fact that we are called to such is proof that it can be attained in Him, for the word says "we can do all things through Christ who strengthens us" right?

The reason for the Lord having me share all this about His Love is that His love is the most powerful thing there is. If we walk in that, what can stop it? the only thing is i feel that deep down we don't really believe in the power of His love else we would walk in it.

Quote:
What is missing here? What are we all about? Do we "Spiritualize" everything in order not to face evil, head to head like Abraham, David, and all the others? We are NOT Jesus Christ, we are men of flesh and blood that have a job to do. The job cannot be done while sitting on the couch, or sitting at our computers fantasizing that we are Jesus Christ, or that we are even like Him. He sees us that way because we have the down payment, the Holy Ghost that lives in our hearts, but we are still not like Him. We have Adams flesh and Adams blood in our veins. We will not be like Him until the rapture. In the meantime, let's all get to work!



the point bro Stever is the best way and the only way in which victory can be secured is to confront all of this with the Love of God. that is how evil is defeated. look at what Christ did on the cross, He defeated the principalities and powers by letting them think they won in His death, then God pulled a fast one and raise Him to life and that was that. they were paraded before creation in defeat!or perhaps we don't believe that God's love can conquer all? you're right in that we are not jesus Christ, but to have the Holy Ghost living in us ought to make us more and more like Him daily in our conduct, thoughts and everything else. if not then what is the point of having the Holy Ghost? i'm not about sit on my butt and grive Him by not wrestling with Him so that i may grow in Holiness and Righteousness to the glory of God the Father and neither should anyone else. if i may ask, what does the "down payment" mean? :-?

bro this is the work, putting Christ on daily, dying to self daily.


_________________
Farai Bamu

 2006/6/10 0:28Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re:

Quote:
This attribute is also revealed in the person of Jesus, born as a male, but manifesting both masculinity and femininity in His actions. When exhibiting feminine qualities, Jesus was more nurturing and relationship-oriented than any woman. When exhibiting masculinity, Jesus was more forceful and results-oriented than



That's utterly absurd


_________________
Mike Balog

 2006/6/10 0:37Profile
roaringlamb
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 1519
Santa Cruz California

 Re:

Quote:
Is there any sentiment on this Christian site that can match early America? The Pastors are the ones that preached the truth from their pulpits. The Pastors are the ones that spread the news about the British atrocities on the Americans living in the colonies (all of the Newspapers were owned by the Crown). The Pastors were the ones that led the cry to battle over and over again. The Church (that's us) followed them into battle. Where are we today?


I will tread carefully here, but I suggest you double check history. Those who brought about the Revolutionary War wer not Christians, but Masons. They had an agenda for America to be the new Atlantis. The Christians were there, probably in William Penn's area (Pennsylvania), and had very little to do with the war.
How can anyone here rejoice over the death of someone? Especially knowing that he could be in hell? What if it had been you, or worse yet one of your loved ones?
Perhaps I am asking the wrong questions, but "love rejoiceth not in evil", now you may say exactly, but I say this also means the death of even this man, as Christ died once for all mankind.
When I saw all the photos, my heart sank, I did not rejoice at all, but prayed for the Iraqi people, and the American soldiers who are over there. May GOD touch our hearts with HIS compassion, even for non Americans.


_________________
patrick heaviside

 2006/6/10 1:06Profile
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 When will the wound of this worlds sin be healed?

Quote:
How can anyone here rejoice over the death of someone?



Would agree... to a point, a different point. Thinking back to David in the Psalms and ... my turn to tread a bit carefully. To be honest, this whole matter left me rather non-pulsed, it's just not something that is at the forefront of the mind. Would also admit to an earlier sentiment expressed of the belief that God still kills people. Annias and Sapphira for a more 'New' Testament example. Of course He still kills everyone by death. This verse seems to have gone greatly unnoticed, I hardly remember seeing it (in it's context) until fairly recently;

Eze 18:4 [i]Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.[/i]

The last part certainly, but the first part...

That a madman has been killed leaves no impression of happiness, nor rejoicing, neither does it bring forth any particular sentiment of sorrow, it all seems very peculiar to me to be emotionaly swayed one way or the other. The first thing that came to mind upon this news was;

Luk 13:2 And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?
Luk 13:3 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Luk 13:4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?
Luk 13:5 I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.


_________________
Mike Balog

 2006/6/10 1:31Profile
roaringlamb
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 1519
Santa Cruz California

 Re: When will the wound of this worlds sin be healed?

Brother Mike it is always a pleasure to have your input. It seems to bring balance. Praise GOD that we have all these differing views yet can for the most part keep CHRIST at the front of it all!


_________________
patrick heaviside

 2006/6/10 1:51Profile
Compton
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732


 Re:

Quote:
What of the American soldiers who are...raping, and committing atrocities...



:-o ?

MC


_________________
Mike Compton

 2006/6/10 2:06Profile
ChrisJD
Member



Joined: 2006/2/11
Posts: 2895
Philadelphia PA

 Re:

Hi everyone.

I would like to recommend a series recently made available here at SI to you all that I think is relevant in some ways to the discussion here. The messages are by Josef Tson

http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=516

The series is called "Communism, Islam, Sept 11, Soverenty Of God"

http://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=11439

I would also recommend the other two messages and in particular "Truth, Love, and Self-Sacrifice - the Weapons of Christ and the Christian"

I pray it will be edifying to you all.


_________________
Christopher Joel Dandrow

 2006/6/10 12:20Profile





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